Tubeless Puncture Experiences + Tools

[LoremIpsum]

Hi,

I'm a long time reader, first-time poster, so please be nice...

I currently ride tubulars with rim brakes (which is intended to give you an idea of the kind of rider I am, not to start another rim vs disc debate). I am building a new bike (Time Alpe D'Huez + SRAM Red Etap) and have accepted that I have had to drop my love of tubulars to allow myself to keep rim brakes and get XDR hubs. So I now have a set of Ursus C37 'tubeless ready' wheels (very happy with those), although temporarily running with inner tubes.

I am assuming (unless convinced otherwise) that I will be fitting tubeless but I'm not sure about what you really need to carry in case of punctures and the general puncture experience is likely to be - going back a number of years before I used tubular you had to carry two inner tubes, levers, CO2 inflater, a tyre boot, maybe a pump and get loads of pinch flats (sorry about the rant and I am going back a more than a few years and suspect things have moved on a little)

For me, perhaps contrary to some opinions, one of the advantages of tubular tyres is that, with the ability to seal most punctures with a product like Vittoria Pit Stop and, if that fails, the ability to run flat (although not the most fun I have ever had) coupled with the lack of pinch flats find I don't get either puncture anxiety or have too much in my back pocket. I've been happy to run like this for my typical riding which is the Surrey hills with a smattering of Mallorca, Alpes and Pyrenees - although I never have descended the Toumelet on a flat .

This brings me to tubeless and I am wondering if anyone has the experience (or wants to throw in an opinion) of migrating to tubeless from using tubular tyres rather than inner tubes. For example, I've been looking around and come across the Vittoria Air-Liner and although the reviews seem a little mixed (mostly struggling to getting it off (although if you are used to having your tyres glued to your wheel, you may not feel the same) - not sure if anyone has any real-life experience of these? I'm also a little confused about the overall puncture risk of tubulars vs tubeless.

My initial hunch was that running Air-Liners additionally with a sealant (and possibly carrying puncture plugs) would effectively give me something similar to tubulars (seal quickly + run flat) - but wonder if there is an undesirable weight penalty (I ride rim brakes ) and/or you still have to carry loads of tools around? I know, despite having sealant, I've seen some people carry inner tubes around anyway but I've never seen them use it and it sounds rather messy.

Also realise I need to throw in the question about the actual tyre - I currently use Cosa Pros (tubular).

Advice and thoughts welcome

[TobinHatesYou]

I run very fast and fragile tubeless tires on rough roads and after a sketchy front flat in a fast group ride, I decided to go back to Vittoria Air Liners. I’d experimented with them before, but stopped using them due to a minor incompatibility issue with Fillmore valves.

Air Liners will add a level of difficulty to mounting and unmounting a tubeless tire, but with all things practice and learning proper technique will speed up the process. Today I installed Air Liners in two GP5K TTs using one tire lever in just 15 minutes. Removal takes even less time.

There is hardly any weight penalty. It’s just foam after all. You can get away with 30g of sealant in a 28mm tire, though I prefer to run 40g. That’s about half the weight of a latex tube. For most rides I don’t carry a spare tube because tubeless takes care of most punctures, plugs take care of the rest, and in the worst case I can ride a flat home or to the nearest bike shop on the Air Liner. My emergency kit for local rides is a DynaPlug Racer Pro plus a Cycplus AS2 Pro electric minipump.

[JWTS]

I run very fast and fragile tubeless tires on rough roads and after a sketchy front flat in a fast group ride, I decided to go back to Vittoria Air Liners. I’d experimented with them before, but stopped using them due to a minor incompatibility issue with Fillmore valves.

What did you do to fix the incompatibility issue there??

To the OP, I'm in the "DynaPlug Racer Pro/2 co2 cartidge camp, but the AS2 pump would actually make more sense--just haven't bought one yet.

I carry a tube and tire level if I'm on a very long ride that has extended gravel sections (on my road bike), no cell service sorta thing. Otherwise, I don't bother. The sealant handles 98% of the flats that I get, and when it doesn't, a Dynaplug will fix it. On some bad punctures, you may lose a good bit of air, which is why I think a compact electric minipump is a better option than co2.

A good quality tire and Orange Seal and you really should be able to ride worry-free.

[basilic]

I have accepted that I have had to drop my love of tubulars to allow myself to keep rim brakes and get XDR hubs.

Apologies for a slight drift - if you like tubulars, why not order a wheelset with tubular rims and xdr hubs? I'm sure Farsports or similar can do that. But sure, why not try different tech.

[CJosephB]

Tubeless Road setup = Silca sealant (if you have the discipline to replenish every ~3 months) + Dynaplug + Cycplus AS2 Pro for the win

[TobinHatesYou]

What did you do to fix the incompatibility issue there??

To the OP, I'm in the "DynaPlug Racer Pro/2 co2 cartidge camp, but the AS2 pump would actually make more sense--just haven't bought one yet.

I carry a tube and tire level if I'm on a very long ride that has extended gravel sections (on my road bike), no cell service sorta thing. Otherwise, I don't bother. The sealant handles 98% of the flats that I get, and when it doesn't, a Dynaplug will fix it. On some bad punctures, you may lose a good bit of air, which is why I think a compact electric minipump is a better option than co2.

A good quality tire and Orange Seal and you really should be able to ride worry-free.

I reluctantly went back to regular Presta valves (with the fluted base.) In order to prevent clogged valve cores, I now drip a bit of light oil into each one every time I refresh my sealant or install a near tire.

And yeah, for long rides into the mountains or to the coast I bring my saddle pack with a TPU tube and a Pedros Micro RX-21 and a couple of quicklinks, but that's really about it.

[we51]

For what it's worth, I've had basically no issues with AIrliners + Fillmore valves on 25mm iw rims running 30mm GP5k STR. Occasionally when injecting sealant through the valve I have to depress the valve through the injector tube to get it started, and not every time.

[DogmaHiFi]

Any bacon strip type repair kit plus CYCPLUS pro max will do your rides trouble free. It takes around 5-6 minutes to continue the ride after a flat

[TobinHatesYou]

For what it's worth, I've had basically no issues with AIrliners + Fillmore valves on 25mm iw rims running 30mm GP5k STR. Occasionally when injecting sealant through the valve I have to depress the valve through the injector tube to get it started, and not every time.

I think it's because you're using what is probably a 33mm WAM tire with the 30-32mm Air Liners while I'm using a 23mm rim with 28mm tires (30.8mm WAM.) Depressing the valve to get things started works sometimes, sometimes not. Eventually the foam molds itself around the base of the valve and it gets a bit gummed up.

[we51]

Yeah makes sense.

[Miller]

On road rides with tubeless it's been years since I carried a spare inner tube. I have a set of sticky worm things to use if an intrusion seems reluctant to seal. I feel it's important that your tlr tyre will not dismount if fully deflated, as this can happen. If the tyre bead remains on the rim shelf, the tyre is easy to reflate. If it dismounts you're probably going to need a CO2 cartridge to blast it back on.

For gravel rides I'll take an inner tube as even a robust tyre can get badly slashed by a sharp rock.

[TobinHatesYou]

Road tires are so thin that I only trust anchored plugs for anything larger than a 2mm cut. If you find DynaPlugs too expensive, just get the Clever Standard Bacon Anchor kit and make your own.

[bobones]

If you're just starting out on tubeless then keep it simple and skip the air liners. In 7 years tubeless I have never felt the need to have them. Yes, I've had a fast downhill blowout on super thin Corsa Speeds, but I was still able to stop safely and get home with a boot and a tube. Tubeless is enough of a phaff without the extra hassle of liners, especially if you're just starting out.

The big mistake people make with tubeless is having no contingency plan for a non-sealing puncture, or immediately jumping to fitting a tube, which will be a messy business. The key is having a good plugging system and Dynaplugs have worked for me after I had little success with bacon strips on their own. (I also own WTB TCS Rocket Tyre Plug Kit but haven't used it yet).

Good sealant like Orange Seal Regular will also lessen potential frustration as long as you ensure there's always some in the tyre. (I've just taken delivery of some Bartender Pro sealant, which promises a lot, but I haven't used it yet either).

I carry 2x CO2 carts as these can help reseat a tyre and help find the location of holes to plug. I also have a small hand pump and a TPU tube in my kit as a last resort. I own a Cycplus inflator but any time I've gone to use it the battery has been flat or there was insufficient charge to inflate the tyre.

Plugs can be a permanent fix, but it's still possible to repair a tubeless tyre by applying a patch to the inside, but leave this type of repair until you're back home.

[TobinHatesYou]

I carry 2x CO2 carts as these can help reseat a tyre and help find the location of holes to plug. I also have a small hand pump and a TPU tube in my kit as a last resort. I own a Cycplus inflator but any time I've gone to use it the battery has been flat or there was insufficient charge to inflate the tyre.

That's strange. My AS2 Pro still had 3 out of 3 bars after going a month without charging. Also the last time I used it, I pumped up a stranger's tire to 90psi and it still had 3 bars after that.

[bobones]

I carry 2x CO2 carts as these can help reseat a tyre and help find the location of holes to plug. I also have a small hand pump and a TPU tube in my kit as a last resort. I own a Cycplus inflator but any time I've gone to use it the battery has been flat or there was insufficient charge to inflate the tyre.

That's strange. My AS2 Pro still had 3 out of 3 bars after going a month without charging. Also the last time I used it, I pumped up a stranger's tire to 90psi and it still had 3 bars after that.

I'm pretty sure it's faulty, but I'm hesitant to buy another as I still prefer having co2 for speed and my hand pump will never run out of juice.

I've had leaks where I struggled to find a hole to plug in the dark with no liquid sealant and just limped home by topping up with the hand pump every few miles. A mini compressor with limited capacity just doesn't provide that kind of security. This reminds me I need to put a much bigger tube in my kit when I'm running 35s and 40s!