Cutting the fat.

A light bike doesn't replace good fitness.

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AggressiveBears
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by AggressiveBears

I have lost something like 35 kilograms from my heaviest to my lightest by restricting carbohydrates.
But the last 10 kilograms between my current weight and my ideal weight have been the bane of my existence for the last few years, since I can't get more powerful while restricting carbs, but (in my experience) I can't get lighter while eating carbs.

Any suggestions?

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Lewn777
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Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 5:35 am

by Lewn777

It's nothing to do with carbs. Carbs are simply fuel. If you restrict carbs you restrict your ability to ride to maximum effort. Instead concentrate on calories. Calculate your calorie intake and an amount used for exercise and aim for a daily deficit in the 500 calorie range and you will lose weight so long as you eat a well balanced mostly whole-food diet.

For example basal calorie need =2500 cal. Indoor cycle racing x2 30 minute sessions =1000 cal.
Total 3500 calories.
Eat between 2800-3000 calories of a normal wholefood diet and you should lose something like a pound a week on average.

People love to complicate things by restricting carbs eating too much protein or some other method but it's mostly just to sell books ans make money. The truth is boring but it's just thermodynamics.

I know you'll hate me because you'll say 'I've lost 35kg doing it by carb restriction, so that can't be the problem'. But believe me I've lost more than that simply following calories and millions of other people have as well. Of course some will chime in with 'calories aren't the whole picture read a book by Dr X'. Of course calories aren't 100% of the picture more like 98-95%.

My sister is a yo-yo dieter and this is caused because she always follows the latest fad. Some fads are better than others, short term fasting/near fasting and ketosis actually quite effective, but nothing is better than just just simply eating less than you burn consistently.

AaronG
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Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2021 1:34 am

by AaronG

I think part of the equation is eating foods that make you feel full. Carbs dont really fit the bill there. I dont restrict carbs in my diet, but I am cognicent of when I am eating them.

bobones
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Joined: Mon Aug 12, 2013 11:19 am

by bobones

Lewn777 is right. The Lose It! app is great for setting a weight loss goal and keeping track of your calorie intake from food and burn from exercise. Counting calories like this keeps you honest, and you're more likely to resist the temptation to have large portions, desserts, or to snack between meals unnecessarily. It will also encourage you to get on your bike or trainer to burn a few calories and stay within your daily budget. You can easily lose 1kg per week just by being a bit more careful with your food intake and cycling for 1-1.5 hours a day. I used this app to lose 28 lbs in 10 weeks back in 2015, although I did a lot of cycling to burn the calories.

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Last edited by bobones on Mon Feb 07, 2022 12:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

CustomMetal
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by CustomMetal

Intermittent fasting?
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joejack951
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by joejack951

If you drink any sugary drinks at all, stop. If you snack late at night, go to bed earlier. If you eat out frequently, cook at home more. Eat more salads and broth-based soups. Drink your coffee black and your tea unsweetened. Take breaks while eating and only eat more if you truly still feel hungry. Cut portions in general.

I had ~5 kg of weight that seemed impossible to lose (to go from 73 kg down to 68). Using the above I got down to 65 kg at times, though I found that unsustainable.

Singular
Posts: 537
Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2020 8:59 am

by Singular

joejack951 is pretty much right on it.

You can follow any type of diet/restrictions (and that's great for those of us who have a tough time with fuzzy guidelines - "everything in moderation" simply does not cut it for everyone), but for the long term (and everyday life) nothing beats sound choices and good habits. And, as hard as it is to admit, most of these we already know;

Cutting out sweet and savoury snacks, calorie-rich drinks, booze in general and limiting intake on processed foods is a great start. Many do great with less "simple", starchy and light carbs. Avoiding late eating, having lots of veggies and staying hydrated is also good habits.

I put a pretty tight cap on myself regarding sweets and beer, have starchy carbs and wine in moderation and devour veg/fruit, proteins and natural fats. I'm a typical endomorph (and at soon 40 yrs old, staying lean is only getting tougher) and with good habits I can be around 70kg (for my 180cm) with my body in balance.

cheapvega
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by cheapvega

Late night snacks are my kryptonite. It really does just come down to habits.

Lina
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Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2018 9:09 pm

by Lina

Lewn777 wrote:
Sun Feb 06, 2022 2:30 pm
It's nothing to do with carbs. Carbs are simply fuel. If you restrict carbs you restrict your ability to ride to maximum effort. Instead concentrate on calories. Calculate your calorie intake and an amount used for exercise and aim for a daily deficit in the 500 calorie range and you will lose weight so long as you eat a well balanced mostly whole-food diet.

For example basal calorie need =2500 cal. Indoor cycle racing x2 30 minute sessions =1000 cal.
Total 3500 calories.
Eat between 2800-3000 calories of a normal wholefood diet and you should lose something like a pound a week on average.

People love to complicate things by restricting carbs eating too much protein or some other method but it's mostly just to sell books ans make money. The truth is boring but it's just thermodynamics.

I know you'll hate me because you'll say 'I've lost 35kg doing it by carb restriction, so that can't be the problem'. But believe me I've lost more than that simply following calories and millions of other people have as well. Of course some will chime in with 'calories aren't the whole picture read a book by Dr X'. Of course calories aren't 100% of the picture more like 98-95%.

My sister is a yo-yo dieter and this is caused because she always follows the latest fad. Some fads are better than others, short term fasting/near fasting and ketosis actually quite effective, but nothing is better than just just simply eating less than you burn consistently.
It's not just that simple. And that's because our bodies react differently to different foods. Sure you can lose weight on most diets as long as you don't overeat but it's gonna be a lot easier if you cut away carbs. It'll also help because you'll feel a lot less hungry if most of your calories come from protein and fat. You could eat 3000 calories of fat and meat in one sitting and not feel hungry for a day. Try that same with a carb heavy meal and you're craving for something pretty soon after the meal. Now carbs aren't all bad, they're great for fueling endurance activities. Though unless you're looking to do high effort riding they're not even necessary for that.

Fad diets don't work because they're impossible to follow long term. Following low carb isn't difficult.

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Lewn777
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Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 5:35 am

by Lewn777

Lina wrote:
Fri Feb 11, 2022 10:23 am
Lewn777 wrote:
Sun Feb 06, 2022 2:30 pm
It's nothing to do with carbs. Carbs are simply fuel. If you restrict carbs you restrict your ability to ride to maximum effort. Instead concentrate on calories. Calculate your calorie intake and an amount used for exercise and aim for a daily deficit in the 500 calorie range and you will lose weight so long as you eat a well balanced mostly whole-food diet.

For example basal calorie need =2500 cal. Indoor cycle racing x2 30 minute sessions =1000 cal.
Total 3500 calories.
Eat between 2800-3000 calories of a normal wholefood diet and you should lose something like a pound a week on average.

People love to complicate things by restricting carbs eating too much protein or some other method but it's mostly just to sell books ans make money. The truth is boring but it's just thermodynamics.

I know you'll hate me because you'll say 'I've lost 35kg doing it by carb restriction, so that can't be the problem'. But believe me I've lost more than that simply following calories and millions of other people have as well. Of course some will chime in with 'calories aren't the whole picture read a book by Dr X'. Of course calories aren't 100% of the picture more like 98-95%.

My sister is a yo-yo dieter and this is caused because she always follows the latest fad. Some fads are better than others, short term fasting/near fasting and ketosis actually quite effective, but nothing is better than just just simply eating less than you burn consistently.
It's not just that simple. And that's because our bodies react differently to different foods. Sure you can lose weight on most diets as long as you don't overeat but it's gonna be a lot easier if you cut away carbs. It'll also help because you'll feel a lot less hungry if most of your calories come from protein and fat. You could eat 3000 calories of fat and meat in one sitting and not feel hungry for a day. Try that same with a carb heavy meal and you're craving for something pretty soon after the meal. Now carbs aren't all bad, they're great for fueling endurance activities. Though unless you're looking to do high effort riding they're not even necessary for that.

Fad diets don't work because they're impossible to follow long term. Following low carb isn't difficult.
You're really off on an anecdotal tangent here. You're opinion seems devoid of any scientific basis.

Of course it's a logical strategy to eat things that will fill you up and have low calorific load like eating a kg of boiled cabbage, but that's within the calorific system.
Sure eating low carb foods on rest days is a logical thing to do on rest days, but it's not a diet technique on it's own it's just something to do within the larger context of burning more than you consume. You're just putting the cart before the horse,

Lina
Posts: 1302
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2018 9:09 pm

by Lina

Lewn777 wrote:
Sat Feb 12, 2022 3:30 pm
Lina wrote:
Fri Feb 11, 2022 10:23 am
Lewn777 wrote:
Sun Feb 06, 2022 2:30 pm
It's nothing to do with carbs. Carbs are simply fuel. If you restrict carbs you restrict your ability to ride to maximum effort. Instead concentrate on calories. Calculate your calorie intake and an amount used for exercise and aim for a daily deficit in the 500 calorie range and you will lose weight so long as you eat a well balanced mostly whole-food diet.

For example basal calorie need =2500 cal. Indoor cycle racing x2 30 minute sessions =1000 cal.
Total 3500 calories.
Eat between 2800-3000 calories of a normal wholefood diet and you should lose something like a pound a week on average.

People love to complicate things by restricting carbs eating too much protein or some other method but it's mostly just to sell books ans make money. The truth is boring but it's just thermodynamics.

I know you'll hate me because you'll say 'I've lost 35kg doing it by carb restriction, so that can't be the problem'. But believe me I've lost more than that simply following calories and millions of other people have as well. Of course some will chime in with 'calories aren't the whole picture read a book by Dr X'. Of course calories aren't 100% of the picture more like 98-95%.

My sister is a yo-yo dieter and this is caused because she always follows the latest fad. Some fads are better than others, short term fasting/near fasting and ketosis actually quite effective, but nothing is better than just just simply eating less than you burn consistently.
It's not just that simple. And that's because our bodies react differently to different foods. Sure you can lose weight on most diets as long as you don't overeat but it's gonna be a lot easier if you cut away carbs. It'll also help because you'll feel a lot less hungry if most of your calories come from protein and fat. You could eat 3000 calories of fat and meat in one sitting and not feel hungry for a day. Try that same with a carb heavy meal and you're craving for something pretty soon after the meal. Now carbs aren't all bad, they're great for fueling endurance activities. Though unless you're looking to do high effort riding they're not even necessary for that.

Fad diets don't work because they're impossible to follow long term. Following low carb isn't difficult.
You're really off on an anecdotal tangent here. You're opinion seems devoid of any scientific basis.

Of course it's a logical strategy to eat things that will fill you up and have low calorific load like eating a kg of boiled cabbage, but that's within the calorific system.
Sure eating low carb foods on rest days is a logical thing to do on rest days, but it's not a diet technique on it's own it's just something to do within the larger context of burning more than you consume. You're just putting the cart before the horse,
Nowhere did I talk about filling yourself with food that has hardly any calories. In fact I talked about the very opposite of that. Eating once a day doesn't even feel difficult if you eat just fat and protein. And there's no need to fill you up with stuff that has no calories. And fat is the most calorie dense macronutrient.

Carbs shoot up your blood sugar for it to only come crashing down couple hours later. They're amazing, and the only option there is, for fueling hard efforts. But for fueling you day to day, especially if you have a sedentary job protein and especially fat is much better. It'll keep your blood sugar levels constant and you won't feel that constant need to snack on something. If you're looking to lose weight and want to count calories it's a lot easier to do with low carb high fat diet where you eat 1-3 times a day and never feel hungry.

And when we're talking about needing carbs to fuel hard efforts that's really the hard efforts. You can do endless Z2 without any carbs once your body is used to operating without a constant stream of carbs. As a bonus you will never bonk.

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Lewn777
Posts: 1266
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 5:35 am

by Lewn777

CustomMetal wrote:
Mon Feb 07, 2022 12:21 pm
Intermittent fasting?
Fasting works because it is another way of burning more than you consume. However with a lack of nutrition generally and a lack of carbohydrate you are going to lose fitness.

A better way would be to eat net zero calories for a few days. Simply calculate basal need: 2500cal eat 3500cal but do 1000 cal of exercise which could be x2 45 minutes of intense cycling. You are then at net zero calories but are getting adequate nutrition.

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Lewn777
Posts: 1266
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 5:35 am

by Lewn777

Lina wrote:
Sat Feb 12, 2022 4:28 pm
Lewn777 wrote:
Sat Feb 12, 2022 3:30 pm
Lina wrote:
Fri Feb 11, 2022 10:23 am
Lewn777 wrote:
Sun Feb 06, 2022 2:30 pm
It's nothing to do with carbs. Carbs are simply fuel. If you restrict carbs you restrict your ability to ride to maximum effort. Instead concentrate on calories. Calculate your calorie intake and an amount used for exercise and aim for a daily deficit in the 500 calorie range and you will lose weight so long as you eat a well balanced mostly whole-food diet.

For example basal calorie need =2500 cal. Indoor cycle racing x2 30 minute sessions =1000 cal.
Total 3500 calories.
Eat between 2800-3000 calories of a normal wholefood diet and you should lose something like a pound a week on average.

People love to complicate things by restricting carbs eating too much protein or some other method but it's mostly just to sell books ans make money. The truth is boring but it's just thermodynamics.

I know you'll hate me because you'll say 'I've lost 35kg doing it by carb restriction, so that can't be the problem'. But believe me I've lost more than that simply following calories and millions of other people have as well. Of course some will chime in with 'calories aren't the whole picture read a book by Dr X'. Of course calories aren't 100% of the picture more like 98-95%.

My sister is a yo-yo dieter and this is caused because she always follows the latest fad. Some fads are better than others, short term fasting/near fasting and ketosis actually quite effective, but nothing is better than just just simply eating less than you burn consistently.
It's not just that simple. And that's because our bodies react differently to different foods. Sure you can lose weight on most diets as long as you don't overeat but it's gonna be a lot easier if you cut away carbs. It'll also help because you'll feel a lot less hungry if most of your calories come from protein and fat. You could eat 3000 calories of fat and meat in one sitting and not feel hungry for a day. Try that same with a carb heavy meal and you're craving for something pretty soon after the meal. Now carbs aren't all bad, they're great for fueling endurance activities. Though unless you're looking to do high effort riding they're not even necessary for that.

Fad diets don't work because they're impossible to follow long term. Following low carb isn't difficult.
You're really off on an anecdotal tangent here. You're opinion seems devoid of any scientific basis.

Of course it's a logical strategy to eat things that will fill you up and have low calorific load like eating a kg of boiled cabbage, but that's within the calorific system.
Sure eating low carb foods on rest days is a logical thing to do on rest days, but it's not a diet technique on it's own it's just something to do within the larger context of burning more than you consume. You're just putting the cart before the horse,
Nowhere did I talk about filling yourself with food that has hardly any calories. In fact I talked about the very opposite of that. Eating once a day doesn't even feel difficult if you eat just fat and protein. And there's no need to fill you up with stuff that has no calories. And fat is the most calorie dense macronutrient.

Carbs shoot up your blood sugar for it to only come crashing down couple hours later. They're amazing, and the only option there is, for fueling hard efforts. But for fueling you day to day, especially if you have a sedentary job protein and especially fat is much better. It'll keep your blood sugar levels constant and you won't feel that constant need to snack on something. If you're looking to lose weight and want to count calories it's a lot easier to do with low carb high fat diet where you eat 1-3 times a day and never feel hungry.

And when we're talking about needing carbs to fuel hard efforts that's really the hard efforts. You can do endless Z2 without any carbs once your body is used to operating without a constant stream of carbs. As a bonus you will never bonk.
Blood sugar always rises after you eat it's perfectly normal, there no need to worry unless you are diabetic. Even if you have a sedentary job you can still burn calories cycle racing on Zwift in the evening. For me it's similar to following a gluten free diet if you don't have Celiacs disease.

Because a diet is good for someone with a disease it doesn't automatically follow that the said diet is therefore good for everyone.

Lina
Posts: 1302
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2018 9:09 pm

by Lina

Lewn777 wrote:
Sat Feb 12, 2022 5:39 pm
Blood sugar always rises after you eat it's perfectly normal, there no need to worry unless you are diabetic. Even if you have a sedentary job you can still burn calories cycle racing on Zwift in the evening. For me it's similar to following a gluten free diet if you don't have Celiacs disease.

Because a diet is good for someone with a disease it doesn't automatically follow that the said diet is therefore good for everyone.
Just because something is normal doesn't mean it's optimal or even good. Also because a diet it good for someone with a disease doesn't mean it's bad for everyone. Humans don't need any gluten, there's no downside to eating gluten free even if you're not intolerant to gluten.

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MattMay
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by MattMay

How does one calculate base calorie need? Sorta skipped over that as if everyone knows how to do that.

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