Gravel tire rolling resistance tested

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wheelzqc
Posts: 266
Joined: Thu Jun 09, 2011 6:51 pm

by wheelzqc

I would also have liked to see Vittoria being tested. Same with Specialized and their gripton tires. Surprinsgly the G-One all around don't test that fast.

menkar
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Aug 10, 2010 5:23 am

by menkar

My experience with Riddlers and Resolutes is very different than the reviewers.

My SuperX came with Riddlers and I rode them for months, even replaced them once when they wore out. I'm 160 lb and I eventually settled on 34 psi for off road.

I was never very satisfied with them. I felt that they were slow and on our rocky SoCal dirt mountain roads I got several sidewall cuts that required me to stop and hold the bike up to get the sealant puddle over the cut. Also once descending smooth fast winding tarmac the tire squirmed badly and lost some grip scaring me.

I switched to Resolutes and like them better in every way. They feel much faster than the Riddlers, I've PR'd sketchy winding dirt descents without hardly trying, and I have yet to get any cuts in them. They feel very secure on tarmac descents too. I've been running them at 30 psi.

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mr4fox
Posts: 276
Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 2:01 pm

by mr4fox

i wish someone would test the rolling resistance of somthing like my Shwalbe MArathon Winter Plus studded Ice tyres im using now....jsut so i can feel better about myself LoL!!

thumper88
Posts: 178
Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2012 7:27 pm

by thumper88

tanhalt wrote:
Thu Jan 24, 2019 11:06 pm
F45 wrote:
Thu Jan 24, 2019 2:01 am
Vittoria Terreno G+ dry would have dominated this test.
Not really (according to my own testing). Vittoria has some sidewall "armoring" they use that seems to slow them down a bit.
Tom,
understand first than I'm not asking you to be snarky, just looking for practical analysis... but what did you think of the Gran Fondo testing methodology and results?
There were some conclusions that seemed reasonable... But... demerits for aesthetics? and the puncture test I would have just kind of accepted, but it's simply not possible that Compass tires are on equal footing with Gravel Kings, or even bettter in some ways, as shown, for puncture resistance.
That, and picking a relatively slow tire as the "best" are the kind of things that cast as bit of doubt on the other results.
Also I'd have liked to see actual numbers for rolling resistance. With that weird scale, I can't tell if the gap from one tire vs another is significant or meaningless...
In the end, I felt that it was KIND of useful, at least once cross-referenced with what litlte other data is out there, plus anecdotal stuff for punctures.
Not as bad as say Bike Radar's deep wheel tedst fiasco. But also not confidence inspiring. I'm def not running right out to buy Riddlers, let alone snatching my suddenly-fragile Gravel Kings off and replacing them with Compasses for Kanza. They'd last 10 miles at most.

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wheelsONfire
Posts: 6283
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Location: NorthEU

by wheelsONfire

Always wondered about those tests.... nobody rides on steel drums.
Bikes:

Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)


Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.

Marin
Posts: 4035
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 11:48 am
Location: Vienna Austria

by Marin

Yawn, not again.

Nobody breaks their frames in a test rig either, and still this is how frames are tested for some absurd reasons.

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euan
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Joined: Sat Sep 05, 2009 11:20 am

by euan

mr4fox wrote:
Mon Feb 04, 2019 8:29 pm
i wish someone would test the rolling resistance of somthing like my Shwalbe MArathon Winter Plus studded Ice tyres im using now....jsut so i can feel better about myself LoL!!
I had that thought earlier when out riding.

tanhalt
Posts: 410
Joined: Wed Dec 27, 2006 6:36 pm

by tanhalt

thumper88 wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 9:56 pm
tanhalt wrote:
Thu Jan 24, 2019 11:06 pm
F45 wrote:
Thu Jan 24, 2019 2:01 am
Vittoria Terreno G+ dry would have dominated this test.
Not really (according to my own testing). Vittoria has some sidewall "armoring" they use that seems to slow them down a bit.
Tom,
understand first than I'm not asking you to be snarky, just looking for practical analysis... but what did you think of the Gran Fondo testing methodology and results?
There were some conclusions that seemed reasonable... But... demerits for aesthetics? and the puncture test I would have just kind of accepted, but it's simply not possible that Compass tires are on equal footing with Gravel Kings, or even bettter in some ways, as shown, for puncture resistance.
That, and picking a relatively slow tire as the "best" are the kind of things that cast as bit of doubt on the other results.
Also I'd have liked to see actual numbers for rolling resistance. With that weird scale, I can't tell if the gap from one tire vs another is significant or meaningless...
In the end, I felt that it was KIND of useful, at least once cross-referenced with what litlte other data is out there, plus anecdotal stuff for punctures.
Not as bad as say Bike Radar's deep wheel tedst fiasco. But also not confidence inspiring. I'm def not running right out to buy Riddlers, let alone snatching my suddenly-fragile Gravel Kings off and replacing them with Compasses for Kanza. They'd last 10 miles at most.
Well...I'd like to see the actual numbers too so that I can judge their context myself, rather than rely on the author's subjective evaluations of them. But, I tend to be a "numbers guy" 8)

Personally, I think that there tends to be a bit of an unfounded concern about the need for "armoring" in tires intended for "gravel" purposes...which results in people thinking that the casings and sidewalls need more "protection" than they really need for offroad use, especially if running tubeless. That just slows people down, especially on smoother, more solid surfaces. That said, once one gets into the dirt, the ability to run low pressures is the thing that allows the lowest rolling resistance...and thus implies that no matter what, wider is better. IME, wide, flexible casing tires run at low pressures are inherently cut and puncture resistant...or, at least moreso than one would guess based on using similarly constructed tires in narrow, high pressure applications. Of course, I have similar opinions about excess tread blocking on mult-surface tires as well.

I really think that the best overall choices for multisurface tires are wide (40mm or greater) tires with very flexible casings (i.e. minimal "armoring, especially in the sidewalls), run tubeless (with sealant) at very low pressures, with the amount of tread texture and/or blocks dependent on the mix and quality of dirt and pavement on a particular course. The only caveat in there is running latex tubes is OK as well 8)

Yeah...on the aesthetics...one thing I think is ironic is people focusing on the sidewalls being tan or not. Originally, the tan sidewalls was the result of the particular tire construction (i.e. tires constructed with a separate, glued-on tread...much like a high quality tubular construction) and thus was an indicator of a "high quality" tire. In other words, something made with a thin, flexible casing and a glued on tread. Of course, eventually tire makers started producing tires vulcanized as a single unit which mimicked the "look" of the high quality tire (tan sidewalls), but using a construction technique that doesn't allow for the same "high quality" attributes. And so, it becomes a fashion element... :noidea:

Marin
Posts: 4035
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 11:48 am
Location: Vienna Austria

by Marin

tanhalt wrote:
Thu Feb 14, 2019 11:04 pm
Personally, I think that there tends to be a bit of an unfounded concern about the need for "armoring" in tires intended for "gravel" purposes...which results in people thinking that the casings and sidewalls need more "protection" than they really need for offroad use, especially if running tubeless. That just slows people down, especially on smoother, more solid surfaces. That said, once one gets into the dirt, the ability to run low pressures is the thing that allows the lowest rolling resistance...and thus implies that no matter what, wider is better. IME, wide, flexible casing tires run at low pressures are inherently cut and puncture resistant...or, at least moreso than one would guess based on using similarly constructed tires in narrow, high pressure applications. Of course, I have similar opinions about excess tread blocking on mult-surface tires as well.
Couldn't agree more.

Plus, a wide but light slick with flexible casing can be very fast on the road as well.

jfranci3
Posts: 1572
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:21 pm

by jfranci3

Question: Do you think there's any point in having a set of 32c-ish slick/"robaix" tires for hardpack and asphalt-heavy days if I have a set of 25f/28r tires for the road and set of 38c GravelKing SK (light tread) tires for soft surfaces?
It looks like the new 32c GP5000 tires roll just as fast as the 25c tires - https://www.bicyclerollingresistance.co ... comparison - in this test. How well would a 32c GP5K TL or Specialized Roubaix Pro or similar far off road at 55-60psi? I'm thinking the 32c tire would be less bouncy on-road and roll slightly better than the gravel tires and be better on wet days than the road tires as they'll have a bit of tread and be less likely to be cut with the lower pressures.

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ultimobici
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by ultimobici

tanhalt wrote:
thumper88 wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 9:56 pm
tanhalt wrote:
Thu Jan 24, 2019 11:06 pm
F45 wrote:
Thu Jan 24, 2019 2:01 am
Vittoria Terreno G+ dry would have dominated this test.
Not really (according to my own testing). Vittoria has some sidewall "armoring" they use that seems to slow them down a bit.
Tom,
understand first than I'm not asking you to be snarky, just looking for practical analysis... but what did you think of the Gran Fondo testing methodology and results?
There were some conclusions that seemed reasonable... But... demerits for aesthetics? and the puncture test I would have just kind of accepted, but it's simply not possible that Compass tires are on equal footing with Gravel Kings, or even bettter in some ways, as shown, for puncture resistance.
That, and picking a relatively slow tire as the "best" are the kind of things that cast as bit of doubt on the other results.
Also I'd have liked to see actual numbers for rolling resistance. With that weird scale, I can't tell if the gap from one tire vs another is significant or meaningless...
In the end, I felt that it was KIND of useful, at least once cross-referenced with what litlte other data is out there, plus anecdotal stuff for punctures.
Not as bad as say Bike Radar's deep wheel tedst fiasco. But also not confidence inspiring. I'm def not running right out to buy Riddlers, let alone snatching my suddenly-fragile Gravel Kings off and replacing them with Compasses for Kanza. They'd last 10 miles at most.
Well...I'd like to see the actual numbers too so that I can judge their context myself, rather than rely on the author's subjective evaluations of them. But, I tend to be a "numbers guy" 8)

Personally, I think that there tends to be a bit of an unfounded concern about the need for "armoring" in tires intended for "gravel" purposes...which results in people thinking that the casings and sidewalls need more "protection" than they really need for offroad use, especially if running tubeless. That just slows people down, especially on smoother, more solid surfaces. That said, once one gets into the dirt, the ability to run low pressures is the thing that allows the lowest rolling resistance...and thus implies that no matter what, wider is better. IME, wide, flexible casing tires run at low pressures are inherently cut and puncture resistant...or, at least moreso than one would guess based on using similarly constructed tires in narrow, high pressure applications. Of course, I have similar opinions about excess tread blocking on mult-surface tires as well.

I really think that the best overall choices for multisurface tires are wide (40mm or greater) tires with very flexible casings (i.e. minimal "armoring, especially in the sidewalls), run tubeless (with sealant) at very low pressures, with the amount of tread texture and/or blocks dependent on the mix and quality of dirt and pavement on a particular course. The only caveat in there is running latex tubes is OK as well 8)

Yeah...on the aesthetics...one thing I think is ironic is people focusing on the sidewalls being tan or not. Originally, the tan sidewalls was the result of the particular tire construction (i.e. tires constructed with a separate, glued-on tread...much like a high quality tubular construction) and thus was an indicator of a "high quality" tire. In other words, something made with a thin, flexible casing and a glued on tread. Of course, eventually tire makers started producing tires vulcanized as a single unit which mimicked the "look" of the high quality tire (tan sidewalls), but using a construction technique that doesn't allow for the same "high quality" attributes. And so, it becomes a fashion element... :noidea:
There’s an interesting interview on cyclingtips with Morgan Nichol of Challenge. He advocates for super supple large volume tyres with minimal or non existent armour. Interesting podcast.


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cerro
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by cerro

euan wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:02 pm
mr4fox wrote:
Mon Feb 04, 2019 8:29 pm
i wish someone would test the rolling resistance of somthing like my Shwalbe MArathon Winter Plus studded Ice tyres im using now....jsut so i can feel better about myself LoL!!
I had that thought earlier when out riding.
I don't think the testing machines can produce so many watts :p

MichaelB
Posts: 993
Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:31 am

by MichaelB

tanhalt wrote:
Thu Feb 14, 2019 11:04 pm

.... user_single unit which mimicked the "look" of the high quality tire (tan sidewalls), but using a construction technique that doesn't allow for the same "high quality" attributes. And so, it becomes a fashion element... :noidea:
Guilty! Hence why I recently bought some WTB Resolute. That and the good reviews for my area/surface that I ride

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spookyload
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by spookyload

Correct me if I am wrong here, but the point of a gravel tire is for grip and traction on loose stuff. It is gravel right? If you want low RR on your gravel bike, put some Continental GP 32mm road tires on it and enjoy the pavement. But again...we are talking off paved surfaces where the point is traction, this higher RR.

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