Yet another narrow bar: Worx Narrow and Super Narrow Bars

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apr46
Posts: 351
Joined: Thu Aug 26, 2021 1:46 pm

by apr46

toxin wrote:
Sat May 25, 2024 6:14 pm
Any info when the larger sizes will be available? 34 cm in the drops doesn't sound very appealing and I don't quite need 28 on the hoods either
mrbrown4001 wrote:
Mon May 27, 2024 12:06 am
Very interested in the bike doc bars that are 38cm at the drops. Want to wait to hear what people riding them for a while say.
These are orderable on aliexpress now and I was messaging with my contact at the factory and she said that all sizes are in stock. Not a bad time to buy if you can get one of the aliexpress choiceday coupons. I am very happy with mine.

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toxin
Posts: 925
Joined: Tue Apr 18, 2023 5:56 pm

by toxin

Was close but decided to hold off for something a little more x-wing/asha like.

rhs2z
Posts: 65
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2017 7:15 pm

by rhs2z

Can someone help me interpret the diagrams on the ashaa RR bar?
https://performance.tootengineering.com ... rr-carbon/

I am assuming the green silhouette some other set of bars to compare it to. What kind of bars?

I am trying to figure out theeffective reach of these bars- the last diagram seems to suggest that it is 6cm extra reach to the ends of the hoods. Is that right

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 13029
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

rhs2z wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2024 2:34 am
Can someone help me interpret the diagrams on the ashaa RR bar?
https://performance.tootengineering.com ... rr-carbon/

I am assuming the green silhouette some other set of bars to compare it to. What kind of bars?

I am trying to figure out theeffective reach of these bars- the last diagram seems to suggest that it is 6cm extra reach to the ends of the hoods. Is that right

The green bars are the ENVE SES AR handlebars (sort of.) Some of the specs are more in-line with the ENVE one-piece bar.

The reach of the Ashaa RR is 118mm. There is approximately 35mm of rise to the hoods compared to normal bars.

apr46
Posts: 351
Joined: Thu Aug 26, 2021 1:46 pm

by apr46

My experience with the BikeDoc/Synergy narrow bars has so far been interesting. I didnt do any A/B/A type testing since re running the hoses to do that was more than i wanted to do, so this is more like a lot of data collected on different days with A and and only a few runs on a test loop with B + anecdotal riding experience.

I swapped from a 100mm stem to a 130mm stem and dropped 15mm of stack between the changes to stem shape and removal of a spacer. I had previously experimented with this on a Kickr Bike and used MyVelo fit to check to see how this affected fit and for me this was roughly neutral. There have been a few things that were counter to my expectations.
  • I expected biggest differences to be at higher speeds in the aero positions on the hoods and when in the drops, but the effects seem to be nearly the same just riding along at 20mph. Looking back at the video about the Worx bars that kicked off this thread, that does track with their findings.
  • the bike feels more stable with the new narrow bars than the old Enve bars, particuarly when riding on the hoods. I am guessing this more down to some specific to me thing that is more Kinesiology than Physics, but it was a huge surprise. Even with the 30mm longer stem, my hands should be about 5% closer to the steering axis of the bike
  • Out of the saddle climbing now feels really good to me, while sprinting still feels a bit off. Maybe I was wrong and need to admit that there might be something to wanting longer bars for leverage to move the bike side to side at a high cadence? I still think of arms as mostly providing a counterbalance so it could just be i am flopping my arms around too much? Not sure what is right
The long reach of the Ashaa bars really makes sense and is probably a signfificant design advantage over the BikeDoc/Synergy bars. I thought that +30mm of reach to the levers vs. my previous fit might be too much, but in reality I might want even more reach.

jo.k
Posts: 215
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2009 11:39 pm
Location: Norway

by jo.k

Track sprinters do fine on narrow bars, I think it's just a matter of getting the technique right (they also have superior upper strength to brace and pull/push the bars, though).

Very nice bike @apr46! And thanks for your detailed reports. My bars are en route to go on my ancient MY2015 Aeroad.

mrlobber
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Location: Where the permanent autumn is

by mrlobber

apr46 wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2024 5:39 am
I expected biggest differences to be at higher speeds in the aero positions on the hoods and when in the drops, but the effects seem to be nearly the same just riding along at 20mph. Looking back at the video about the Worx bars that kicked off this thread, that does track with their findings.[/list]
So just to be sure I understood properly, you see observable kph gains also at low speeds?
Minimum bike categories required in the stable:
Aero bike | GC bike | GC rim bike | Climbing bike | Climbing rim bike | Classics bike | Gravel bike | TT bike | Indoors bike

escott
Posts: 7
Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2021 7:10 pm

by escott

Adding another data point: 6 days from order to delivery for me in the United States. Nice! I probably won't have a chance to swap out the bars for a week or two though. I'm looking forward to seeing how they feel vs. my current Enve 35/40 cm bars.

apr46
Posts: 351
Joined: Thu Aug 26, 2021 1:46 pm

by apr46

@jo.k Thank you! I know the problem is me. The question is whether its my spindley little arms or lack of technique or both. I should say I am not seeing any real drop off in power or speed. It just feels different in a way i dont love.

@mrlobber I would need to do actual testing to quantify this and while my bike is equiped with hydraulic couplers in the stem for maintenance and I have an extra pair of AXS levers, I would need to swap on and off both the stem AND the bars between runs making this a pretty difficult thing to do. That said, for me, I am initially observing differences that seem a lot more obvious than shallow alloy rims to these carbon aero ones. To me, its obvious even at 30km/h.

These bars are probably not that aero by themselves and so I would guess that a lot of what I am seeing is a result of my stature and may not be relatable to riders of other sizes. I am small: ~170cm with pretty average torso to leg ratio and above average hip, shoulder and back mobility and lack of impingement in either the shoulders or the hips. I beleive I end up with a reduced frontal area even when out of the saddle. I also think the narrower bars (28cm/34cm) and longer stem (+3cm) has also meant that my arms have less tendency to flare out. The position with the Enve 35cm/40cm Aero bars was already difficult to acheive on most bikes, but the one with these narrow bars would require a 140mm stem with an angle lower than -17 degrees on most smaller sized bikes, so another caveat is that I am unsure if my observations would hold for someone with a more traditional fit.

rhs2z
Posts: 65
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2017 7:15 pm

by rhs2z

TobinHatesYou wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2024 3:14 am

The green bars are the ENVE SES AR handlebars (sort of.) Some of the specs are more in-line with the ENVE one-piece bar.

The reach of the Ashaa RR is 118mm. There is approximately 35mm of rise to the hoods compared to normal bars.
Thanks for explaining this. Do you know what the motivation for the 35mm of rise? Is it supposed to be an aero advantage mimicking the way that modern TT bars raise up the forearms?

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 13029
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

rhs2z wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2024 8:52 pm

Thanks for explaining this. Do you know what the motivation for the 35mm of rise? Is it supposed to be an aero advantage mimicking the way that modern TT bars raise up the forearms?

Forearms and hands act as a deflector for the groin/chest, yes,

rhs2z
Posts: 65
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2017 7:15 pm

by rhs2z

TobinHatesYou wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2024 9:19 pm
rhs2z wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2024 8:52 pm

Thanks for explaining this. Do you know what the motivation for the 35mm of rise? Is it supposed to be an aero advantage mimicking the way that modern TT bars raise up the forearms?

Forearms and hands act as a deflector for the groin/chest, yes,
Thanks. I saw in another thread that you ordered these bars. How do you like them compared to ornix? That’s what I am currently running

rhs2z
Posts: 65
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2017 7:15 pm

by rhs2z

A headline today on the ashaa bar.
https://www.globalcyclingnetwork.com/te ... e-same-day

I want to get these bars but will be unhappy if I spend a fortune and then they are banned lol

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wheelbuilder
Posts: 1318
Joined: Wed Feb 08, 2017 2:10 am

by wheelbuilder

That article gives literally no details at all.
Never cheer before you know who is winning

Lina
Posts: 1269
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2018 9:09 pm

by Lina

If forearms are not allowed as a point of support then the first image in the article goes against the rule in my opinion. That's just puppy paws with extra steps trying to get around the rules. It looks like a position he could not stay in without the forearms acting as a point of support, and that imo is a reasonable line to draw on what position is against the rule and what isn't. If your wrists/forearms are making contact with the bars but you're holding the hoods/bars in a way that you could support yourself by only holding them then it should be legal. If you've got a couple fingers touching the hoods while you're re-enacting puppy paws then that is in all intents and purposes against both the letter and the spirit of the rule.

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