Which Brand of Tubeless Tape

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maxima
Posts: 460
Joined: Fri Oct 17, 2008 9:37 am

by maxima

I would like to get feedback on the brand of tubeless rim tape and whcih brand have teh strongest adhesive? I've been having issue with DT swiss, Muc off tubeless tape coming apart after a month or 2 and starts to leak with Joe's, Silca, Muc Off and Orange seal. BTW I stay in a very high humility area all year round. The issue is the leaks starts to get worst as the sealant goes thru the tape to the spoke holes over 1 to 2 months -- it is getting too time and cost consuming and I wonder any brands is better than others in adhesive strength and sealant resistance.

by Weenie


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TobinHatesYou
Posts: 12456
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

If you're having issues with two different tapes, maybe the tape isn't the problem. Your taping technique made need improvement. You may be using too narrow of a tape for your rims. For example, I like having my tape ride up the edges of my my rim wall. Sealant would have to creep well under the tire bead, then up and over before touching the rim bed.

pushpush
Posts: 291
Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2023 5:10 am

by pushpush

I like stans tape best. I also like the enve tape. They each feel different when taping the wheel, but once installed they all kind of work the same for me.

I do NOT like my tape to ride up the edges of the rim wall. I like the tire to make direct contact with as much rim wall as possible. Does it make any real difference? I don't know. I've never had any trouble with tape that conforms to the rim bed AND is wide enough to still touch both rim walls. Wider probably works just as well, but once one thing works for you, it is so easy to just keep doing it that way. Maybe I should try using a slightly wider tape next time.

Things to try: This is what reliably works for me. YMMV
Strip the tape off.
CLEAN your rim beds. Use a mild solvent.
Feel along the inside of the wheels or small lips or edges that are leftover from manufacturing. Smooth these using whatever means you are comfortable with....
Apply new tape. Do this with pretty intense taughtness to ensure the tape conforms to the shape of the wheel bed. If it is warm out I dont do anything special. If it is cold I like to bring everything inside for a couple of hours and let it warm up a bit. Adhesives work better when they are warmer and the tape is usually easier to work with.
Two wraps, overlapping a few inches past the stem hole
Use something solid and not abrasive to really press the tape to the wheel bed. I like to use a pencil eraser with a small amount of tire sealant as lubricant and run around the inside of the wheel on each side the wheel bed. This takes 30seconds to do and helps ensure you have a good adhesive bond all around.
I crisscross cut the tape at the stem hole, cleanly insert the stem, and tighten the nut while minimizing any twisting or rotating of the stem.

Mount tires, inflate to seat
Add sealant
Add valves
Inflate and pressure set. Spin those wheels a bit every few hours to ensure any slow leaks get sealed up.

Ride and enjoy.

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 12456
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

pushpush wrote:
Tue Feb 28, 2023 6:06 am
I like stans tape best. I also like the enve tape. They each feel different when taping the wheel, but once installed they all kind of work the same for me.

I do NOT like my tape to ride up the edges of the rim wall. I like the tire to make direct contact with as much rim wall as possible. Does it make any real difference? I don't know. I've never had any trouble with tape that conforms to the rim bed AND is wide enough to still touch both rim walls. Wider probably works just as well, but once one thing works for you, it is so easy to just keep doing it that way. Maybe I should try using a slightly wider tape next time.

Things to try: This is what reliably works for me. YMMV
Strip the tape off.
CLEAN your rim beds. Use a mild solvent.
Feel along the inside of the wheels or small lips or edges that are leftover from manufacturing. Smooth these using whatever means you are comfortable with....
Apply new tape. Do this with pretty intense taughtness to ensure the tape conforms to the shape of the wheel bed. If it is warm out I dont do anything special. If it is cold I like to bring everything inside for a couple of hours and let it warm up a bit. Adhesives work better when they are warmer and the tape is usually easier to work with.
Two wraps, overlapping a few inches past the stem hole
Use something solid and not abrasive to really press the tape to the wheel bed. I like to use a pencil eraser with a small amount of tire sealant as lubricant and run around the inside of the wheel on each side the wheel bed. This takes 30seconds to do and helps ensure you have a good adhesive bond all around.
I crisscross cut the tape at the stem hole, cleanly insert the stem, and tighten the nut while minimizing any twisting or rotating of the stem.

Mount tires, inflate to seat
Add sealant
Add valves
Inflate and pressure set. Spin those wheels a bit every few hours to ensure any slow leaks get sealed up.

Ride and enjoy.

Ask yourself this. Why would you want your tire to make direct contact with a rougher surface for the purposes of sealing? The more taped around the bead, the less likely it will shift when you pop the bead out.

Also just head up the tip of an awl with a lighter and poke a hole through the valve hole. That way there won't any risk of the criss-cuts tearing under tension or forces from the rubber bung.

CampagYOLO
Posts: 705
Joined: Thu May 06, 2021 3:58 pm

by CampagYOLO

Tesa 4289 tape. Cheaper and better than anything with a cycling brand name on.

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Orlok
Posts: 225
Joined: Tue Feb 07, 2017 12:36 pm
Location: Almere - Nederland

by Orlok

TobinHatesYou wrote:
Tue Feb 28, 2023 2:12 am
If you're having issues with two different tapes, maybe the tape isn't the problem. Your taping technique made need improvement. You may be using too narrow of a tape for your rims. For example, I like having my tape ride up the edges of my my rim wall. Sealant would have to creep well under the tire bead, then up and over before touching the rim bed.
:thumbup:
Once comes a time that you'll have a tailwind :D
Pinarello F10 - Ultegra 8050 Di2 - Carbonspeed C38 Tubeless

voicycle
Posts: 170
Joined: Thu Apr 08, 2021 8:38 am

by voicycle

TobinHatesYou wrote:
Tue Feb 28, 2023 8:23 am
Why would you want your tire to make direct contact with a rougher surface for the purposes of sealing?
I suspect this is about confidence that the bead will be retained by a hookless rim during hard cornering. I see merit in that logic in terms of safety, but if the primary concern is longevity of the tape then I see the logic of taping up the sides too.

I'll +1 for the Tesa tape. Not sure about costs where OP is, but I can buy a whole roll in almost any width for about the same cost as a wheelset's worth of tubeless tape from a cycling brand. A roll of Tesa can do like a dozen wheels so it's great value for money, and it's nearly identical to what a lot of brands badge as their own tubeless tape anyway.

Cleaning and smoothing are good tips. I also find I get much better results when I really pull on the tape during install to get it to stretch and conform to the shape of the rim bed. That would be my #1 tip.

Steve Curtis
Posts: 1314
Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2008 12:20 pm
Location: Hampshire UK, Dublin Ireland and Geneva Switzerland.

by Steve Curtis

Once taped, put on a tyre and inner tube and inflate to really push the tape to the rim.
Leave for a few hours or overnight, and it will be fully adhered all over so it won't allow any sealant to seep under the layers.

I first started using tubeless 20 years ago with mtb, and surprised it still isn't a fully developed foolproof system.

splzd
Posts: 140
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2020 11:11 am

by splzd

CampagYOLO wrote:
Tue Feb 28, 2023 9:40 am
Tesa 4289 tape. Cheaper and better than anything with a cycling brand name on.
this!

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 12456
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

3M 8992 or green powder coat masking tape. In the US you can buy generic in 1/8” increments from EPSI. Better silicone adhesive than Tesa’s rubber adhesive, better elongation and plenty of tensile strength.

As for pressing down the tape. I just run the end of a Pedro’s tire lever over the edges of the tape.

rwoofer
Posts: 97
Joined: Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:24 pm

by rwoofer

Another vote for putting in a tube and leaving overnight pumped up (at highest possible pressure). Always works for me.

torger
Posts: 14
Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2019 7:45 am

by torger

I use 3M 8992, which I think Mavic also use. The bike-branded tapes are often standard tapes from the large manufacturers just rebranded. I think that it's quite hard to tape well, as you cannot have any wrinkles anywere (sealant will creep in), and oftentimes the shape of the rim bed makes it difficult to tape down. So I try to put in some effort to make it right. Weight-weenie brain-damage keeps me from doing two layers, but it's probably a good idea to do two. That trick with leaving a tube in overnight is probably also a great idea, but I've never done it so far because I'm not patient enough...

Nowadays I usually get the taping right, but I have had issues with leaking tape in the past, and those slow leaks are really frustrating. Is it the taping? Is it the valve? Is it the valve seal? Is it the tire bead? Orange seal which I use now also seems better at plugging slow leaks caused by tubeless setup imperfections (with the side effect it's better at plugging the valve core as well).

bobones
Posts: 1271
Joined: Mon Aug 12, 2013 11:19 am

by bobones

I also like Tesa 4288, which is black and slightly thinner/lighter than 4289. I find it stretches, adheres and conforms as well as green power coat masking tape, and the finished rim looks better with black tape IMO. You can buy 66m rolls of this on eBay, at least in the UK, for a decent price.

Two wraps will perform and last better than one and provides a margin for error. I start opposite the valve and have no overlap if doing two layers. Overlapping at the valve is only necessary if you're doing one round. Some tyre/rim combinations need more than 2 rounds of tape to inflate and seat easily and oftern the quickest fix is just to add layers as necessary.

If I'm retaping rim, I'll use WD40 and a rag to rub off any old glue residue, and then IPA to clean the rim. Warming the tape over a radiator or bringing it indoors overnight also helps with application.

After applying the tape, I also use a Pedros tyre lever to press down the edges and heat the tip of an awl to make the valve hole.

pushpush
Posts: 291
Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2023 5:10 am

by pushpush

TobinHatesYou wrote:
Tue Feb 28, 2023 8:23 am

Ask yourself this. Why would you want your tire to make direct contact with a rougher surface for the purposes of sealing? The more taped around the bead, the less likely it will shift when you pop the bead out.

Also just head up the tip of an awl with a lighter and poke a hole through the valve hole. That way there won't any risk of the criss-cuts tearing under tension or forces from the rubber bung.
Given how securely I've seen tires bond after some sealant dries, It has always struck me that should the tire ever roll over due to low pressure it could lift the tape and create a leak if the tire was seated on the tape at the edges rather than bonded directly to the wheel. Your point about smoothness of the tape surface is a good one. I have no argument against that! Good tip on the hot poker. I'll do that next time.

DaveS
Posts: 3922
Joined: Fri Mar 24, 2006 1:26 pm
Location: Loveland Colorado

by DaveS

Zipp hookless wheels are taped at the factory. The tape covers the entire rim bed but does not extend onto the vertical hookless wall. That's what I'll do if retaping. My 303s wheels are over a year old now. I hope the tape lasts for a second year.

by Weenie


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