Am I being dumb for throwing away easy watts by not waxing my chain?
Moderator: robbosmans
Everyone's all on about waxing their chains. I use rock n roll gold and a microfiber towel. My chain is pretty much always clean and feels good.
I use only KMC and SRAM chains, in particular x11SL and xx1 eagle.
Don't bore me by telling me about unrelated things someone can do with their time besides mess around incessantly with their chain, because that's what I'm doing now. I need to be convinced this is worth it. Or not, that's OK too.
I use only KMC and SRAM chains, in particular x11SL and xx1 eagle.
Don't bore me by telling me about unrelated things someone can do with their time besides mess around incessantly with their chain, because that's what I'm doing now. I need to be convinced this is worth it. Or not, that's OK too.
I use Smoove (drip wax) and do an extensive removal of the factory grease. Then I put Smoove on the chain and put it in a plastic bag to get better penetration. I dip the plastic bag in hot water to get the Smoove to flow. After a few days I have a chain that is ready.
Here is the result:
RocknRoll Gold: chain is stretched to .5 on a chain checker in six months.
Smoove: after 2 years, chain still hasn't stretched to .5mm and I replaced it just because it was old.
For me, the extra prep is worth the drivetrain longevity. You'd get the same longevity with hot dip wax as well. Drivetrain longevity is proven in ZeroFriction tests.
Personally, I could care less about the 2-3 watts saved.
I think if you wanted your chain to last with RocknRoll Gold, you'd really need to do a full clean/strip/lube like once a month rather than just relube and wipe down which just removed dirt on the outside of the chain.
Here is the result:
RocknRoll Gold: chain is stretched to .5 on a chain checker in six months.
Smoove: after 2 years, chain still hasn't stretched to .5mm and I replaced it just because it was old.
For me, the extra prep is worth the drivetrain longevity. You'd get the same longevity with hot dip wax as well. Drivetrain longevity is proven in ZeroFriction tests.
Personally, I could care less about the 2-3 watts saved.
I think if you wanted your chain to last with RocknRoll Gold, you'd really need to do a full clean/strip/lube like once a month rather than just relube and wipe down which just removed dirt on the outside of the chain.
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CeramicSpeed UFO Drip is the easiest lube to live with and doesn't come with the commitment of molten wax. Currently I'm trying Effetto Mariposa Flower Power but I'm fairly certain I'm going back to UFO Drip for dry weather and keeping a bottle of Silca Super Secret for wetter conditions.
My experience with KMC chains and rock n roll gold is that the chains last a long ass time. I want to say typically 3000+ miles and still passing the first elongation check with the little gauge thing. Maybe fails the first check after 4000-5000 miles.
If youre looking for every last watt because youre racing yes.
Otherwise no, and thats coming form someone that waxes chains every 250km (because I can and because I run Red AXS when cassettes and chains are stupidly expensive)
Any measurable gain would possibly be worth it to me, is 5w realistic?
I'm pretty easy on equipment and stuff tends to last a while for me so I'm not concerned about wear.
I only started waxing to keep my drivetrain clean and to reduce wear on the components. Waxing does both of those things very well. Once you have a setup it really is easy to maintain. Ill use super secret wax drip between full hot wax dips. So nice not having greasy chains and cassettes anymore. At my level ill never worry about the watt savings.
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5W would be the difference between a really, really, really bad lube the and the best lube.
Got it thanks, so I'm looking at a couple watts, interesting.TobinHatesYou wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:42 pm5W would be the difference between a really, really, really bad lube the and the best lube.
I've used a lot of lubes and have recently started using Tru Tension Bananaslip Tungsten lube.
It's been a revelation to me.
Chain stays dry, clean and silent. Minimum fuss, easy application and gears run smooth as you like.
It's not overly expensive, and even smells of banana...what's not to like?!
Came out very well in the ZeroFriction tests which is why I gave it a punt in the first place.
I like it so much I've ordered up a few spare bottles - no interest in trying anything else now - to me this is the perfect blend of convenience and performance.
It's been a revelation to me.
Chain stays dry, clean and silent. Minimum fuss, easy application and gears run smooth as you like.
It's not overly expensive, and even smells of banana...what's not to like?!
Came out very well in the ZeroFriction tests which is why I gave it a punt in the first place.
I like it so much I've ordered up a few spare bottles - no interest in trying anything else now - to me this is the perfect blend of convenience and performance.
I would say it could exceed those 5w over time, if you consider a bad lube performance deteriorates faster and allow to get “crap” in the chain. Crap you will only remove through multiple bath cleaning.
Good lubes allow you to go back to top performance easier than bad lube.
Another gains not documented is that a top performance lube allow your complete drivetrain to wear way less and, then, have chain/casset/rings pitch to perfectly match, so have initial, optimal performance.
Good lubes allow you to go back to top performance easier than bad lube.
Another gains not documented is that a top performance lube allow your complete drivetrain to wear way less and, then, have chain/casset/rings pitch to perfectly match, so have initial, optimal performance.
^^TobinHatesYou wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:18 pmCeramicSpeed UFO Drip is the easiest lube to live with and doesn't come with the commitment of molten wax. Currently I'm trying Effetto Mariposa Flower Power but I'm fairly certain I'm going back to UFO Drip for dry weather and keeping a bottle of Silca Super Secret for wetter conditions.
CeramicSpeed UFO is the way forward. Most of the benefits of waxing without the hassles of crockpots and risks of worn out quick links. Chain stays very clean too.
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It all depends on people. If you're a single bike, single chain person, that might be a hassle.
But for me, hot waxing is the hassle free solution. I have 3 bikes + a MTB, each with two chains that I rotate. For road+gravel, a single waxing goes about 3000 miles (6x500miles, tho It often requires a liquid wax top up in the last 100miles). That takes me about 1h30min for the 6 chains, twice a year, and that's it. 3 hours a year for taking care of the drivetrain... and the drivetrain is always sparking clean. By far the cleanest and less time consuming solution, no way I would ever go back to oil/grease ...
That said, don't do it for the watts. Perhaps do it for the longevity of you chain, you can get couple thousand km of chain life, but as far as Watts are concerned, versus the very best thin oil, the gain is almost none.
Look at this study: https://www.ceramicspeed.com/media/3505 ... mbined.pdf
Some of the best oils (as well as olive oil lol) are within 1w from the very best Wax, that's probably more than the margin of error of the study
But for me, hot waxing is the hassle free solution. I have 3 bikes + a MTB, each with two chains that I rotate. For road+gravel, a single waxing goes about 3000 miles (6x500miles, tho It often requires a liquid wax top up in the last 100miles). That takes me about 1h30min for the 6 chains, twice a year, and that's it. 3 hours a year for taking care of the drivetrain... and the drivetrain is always sparking clean. By far the cleanest and less time consuming solution, no way I would ever go back to oil/grease ...
That said, don't do it for the watts. Perhaps do it for the longevity of you chain, you can get couple thousand km of chain life, but as far as Watts are concerned, versus the very best thin oil, the gain is almost none.
Look at this study: https://www.ceramicspeed.com/media/3505 ... mbined.pdf
Some of the best oils (as well as olive oil lol) are within 1w from the very best Wax, that's probably more than the margin of error of the study
Last edited by Yoln on Fri Jan 20, 2023 1:21 am, edited 2 times in total.
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That's not a long time. I changed my last waxed chain after 2 years / 10k miles and it hadn't even hit the first wear mark (.5mm). I only changed it because I couldn't believe how long it was lasting.
Will look into this as well as other options thanksNickldn wrote: ↑Fri Jan 20, 2023 12:03 am^^TobinHatesYou wrote: ↑Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:18 pmCeramicSpeed UFO Drip is the easiest lube to live with and doesn't come with the commitment of molten wax. Currently I'm trying Effetto Mariposa Flower Power but I'm fairly certain I'm going back to UFO Drip for dry weather and keeping a bottle of Silca Super Secret for wetter conditions.
CeramicSpeed UFO is the way forward. Most of the benefits of waxing without the hassles of crockpots and risks of worn out quick links. Chain stays very clean too.
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