Rumors Next Generation Campagnolo Road?

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Ritxis
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by Ritxis

Vespasianus wrote:
Sat Mar 25, 2023 4:05 pm
BenCousins wrote:
Sat Mar 25, 2023 11:46 am
I think all the talk about shifting efficiency is moot. Nobody choses Campag because it's efficient. It's an emotional choice or habit. Effciency is for Shimano users.
Well they should. For mechanical shifting, shimano is 105 nowhere as good as a campag chorus or H11. Shimano 105 is slow, clunkey and just cheap feeling. the most over-rated - media driven -product in the cycling industry.

You have to be a fan of Campagnolo and/or a Shimano hater, to affirm certain things that you say about 105.....
It will be cheap yes..... but it works impeccably......with closed eyes you can't tell it from a working Ultegra and Dura-ace............

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m68k
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by m68k

https://www.smi-radsport.de/Fahrradteil ... satzteile/

This is a link to bike shop in Germany, which is selling Capagnolo spareparts.

BenCousins
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by BenCousins

Ritxis wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2023 8:25 am
Vespasianus wrote:
Sat Mar 25, 2023 4:05 pm
BenCousins wrote:
Sat Mar 25, 2023 11:46 am
I think all the talk about shifting efficiency is moot. Nobody choses Campag because it's efficient. It's an emotional choice or habit. Effciency is for Shimano users.
Well they should. For mechanical shifting, shimano is 105 nowhere as good as a campag chorus or H11. Shimano 105 is slow, clunkey and just cheap feeling. the most over-rated - media driven -product in the cycling industry.

You have to be a fan of Campagnolo and/or a Shimano hater, to affirm certain things that you say about 105.....
It will be cheap yes..... but it works impeccably......with closed eyes you can't tell it from a working Ultegra and Dura-ace............
Indeed, I'm a Campag guy, but when travelling constantly hire bikes and they always have Shimano on them (obviously). Last six months I've had mechanical DA, Ultegra and 105 as well as electronic DA and Ultegra. Given the hire bikes are ass heavy anyway (imagine an SL7 covered in frame protectors! :x ), the difference between these groups is really minimal. It actually took me like 30km before I even noticed they'd given me a bike with 105 instead of Ultegra when I was in Lisbon.

robertbb
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by robertbb

Ben Cousins goes BANG :lol:

Vespasianus
Posts: 283
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by Vespasianus

BenCousins wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2023 9:11 am
Ritxis wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2023 8:25 am
Vespasianus wrote:
Sat Mar 25, 2023 4:05 pm
BenCousins wrote:
Sat Mar 25, 2023 11:46 am
I think all the talk about shifting efficiency is moot. Nobody choses Campag because it's efficient. It's an emotional choice or habit. Effciency is for Shimano users.
Well they should. For mechanical shifting, shimano is 105 nowhere as good as a campag chorus or H11. Shimano 105 is slow, clunkey and just cheap feeling. the most over-rated - media driven -product in the cycling industry.

You have to be a fan of Campagnolo and/or a Shimano hater, to affirm certain things that you say about 105.....
It will be cheap yes..... but it works impeccably......with closed eyes you can't tell it from a working Ultegra and Dura-ace............
Indeed, I'm a Campag guy, but when travelling constantly hire bikes and they always have Shimano on them (obviously). Last six months I've had mechanical DA, Ultegra and 105 as well as electronic DA and Ultegra. Given the hire bikes are ass heavy anyway (imagine an SL7 covered in frame protectors! :x ), the difference between these groups is really minimal. It actually took me like 30km before I even noticed they'd given me a bike with 105 instead of Ultegra when I was in Lisbon.
I am not that different than you and find that non electronic shimano stuff feels bad. I have a bike with 3 year old 105 and spent over 6 months on a di2 Ultegra system. Di2 shifting was great but much more similar to the Campag system I have on another bike (H11), than the 105 system. The 105 feels cheap, slow and clunky in comparison.
Cinelli Superstar - Campagnolo H11
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ultimobici
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by ultimobici

Vespasianus wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2023 1:03 pm
I am not that different than you and find that non electronic shimano stuff feels bad. I have a bike with 3 year old 105 and spent over 6 months on a di2 Ultegra system. Di2 shifting was great but much more similar to the Campag system I have on another bike (H11), than the 105 system. The 105 feels cheap, slow and clunky in comparison.
You're comparing 105 mechanical to Ultegra Di2 and Campag H11? How is that a fair comparison? That said, if a groupset is installed by a competent mechanic, 105 shifts cleanly and precisely day in day out. If the mechanic isn't that great, any groupset will shift like a bag of spanners.

Nickldn
Posts: 1867
Joined: Mon Mar 25, 2019 12:35 am

by Nickldn

Vespasianus wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2023 1:03 pm
I am not that different than you and find that non electronic shimano stuff feels bad. I have a bike with 3 year old 105 and spent over 6 months on a di2 Ultegra system. Di2 shifting was great but much more similar to the Campag system I have on another bike (H11), than the 105 system. The 105 feels cheap, slow and clunky in comparison.
You didn't have it set up right.

I had R7000 on a Giant Contend for a time and it had the smoothest and easiest shifting ever. It was uncanny how buttery smooth front and rear shifts were on that bike. Very dull tho.

The R7000/R8000/R9100 gen Shimano mechanical groups are fantastically engineered and all 3 tiers provide great shifting. Perhaps not good with internal routing and worn cables, but mechanical perfection if set up right, even the R7000.

I have Chorus 12s now and shifting is nowhere near as smooth and effortless as R7000. But the Campy it is engaging and fun, while the Shimano was dull and did not make me want to ride the bike. Campy need to make sure they retain their traditional character in the next gen, otherwise there's no reason to buy it over Shimano.
Last edited by Nickldn on Sun Mar 26, 2023 2:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Giant Propel Advanced SL Red Etap 11s Easton EC90 wheels CeramicSpeed BB Zipp SL70 bars 6.5kg

Vitus ZX1 CRS Campy Chorus 12s Bora WTO 45 disk brake wheels Zipp SL70 bars 7.5kg

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m68k
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by m68k

Besides a lot of personal opinions in favor or against any bike brand, could we focus on what's coming next from Campagnol ?
So far it seems to be sure, that there should come a WRL Super Record for the 90ies aniversary.
And Campagnolo seems to claim to become a choice for OEM-Market again.

I just remember Potenza to have been such an attempt, and maybe Xenon, Mirage, Avanti, Veloce, Daytona, Athena, Centaur too.

Do we know anything about that attempt ?

morrisond
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Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2004 8:34 pm

by morrisond

m68k wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2023 1:52 pm
Besides a lot of personal opinions in favor or against any bike brand, could we focus on what's coming next from Campagnol ?
So far it seems to be sure, that there should come a WRL Super Record for the 90ies aniversary.
And Campagnolo seems to claim to become a choice for OEM-Market again.

I just remember Potenza to have been such an attempt, and maybe Xenon, Mirage, Avanti, Veloce, Daytona, Athena, Centaur too.

Do we know anything about that attempt ?
Where have you read anything about that claim?

m68k
Posts: 13
Joined: Sun Jul 14, 2019 10:47 pm

by m68k

morrisond wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2023 3:14 pm
m68k wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2023 1:52 pm
Besides a lot of personal opinions in favor or against any bike brand, could we focus on what's coming next from Campagnol ?
So far it seems to be sure, that there should come a WRL Super Record for the 90ies aniversary.
And Campagnolo seems to claim to become a choice for OEM-Market again.

I just remember Potenza to have been such an attempt, and maybe Xenon, Mirage, Avanti, Veloce, Daytona, Athena, Centaur too.

Do we know anything about that attempt ?
Where have you read anything about that claim?
Sorry, I think I mixed up the sources. It was over here:
https://www.cyclingtips.com/2022/05/cam ... #_pay-wall

m68k
Posts: 13
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by m68k

This one is interesting too. It comprehend everything said here.
https://www.cyclingtips.com/2023/03/cam ... er-coming/

Vespasianus
Posts: 283
Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2020 10:15 pm

by Vespasianus

m68k wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2023 1:52 pm
Besides a lot of personal opinions in favor or against any bike brand, could we focus on what's coming next from Campagnol ?
So far it seems to be sure, that there should come a WRL Super Record for the 90ies aniversary.
And Campagnolo seems to claim to become a choice for OEM-Market again.

I just remember Potenza to have been such an attempt, and maybe Xenon, Mirage, Avanti, Veloce, Daytona, Athena, Centaur too.

Do we know anything about that attempt ?
I don't think they want that. Potenza was a good choice but having two 11 speeds groups was confusing, even if one was rim brake only and one had a disc brake option. If you look at the current price structure, Chorus has moved a bit lower and is now the entry level Camapgnolo group and in that regard, is very competative. Campagnolo will not compete at the low end, and they should not. OEM will go to the cheaper chinese groupsets that are coming, not to Campag.

The lower priced EPS versions that I have tried (Athena 11 speed) have been dissapointing. If they do offer up another, non mechanical group, it should at least be as good if not better than the competetion. Shimano di2 shifts fast in the rear (as good as any top end mechanical system) and the front is just automatic- much better than any mechanical system. But I don't think we will ever see that. I could see a Record WPS but not a chorus.
Cinelli Superstar - Campagnolo H11
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Martin.dk
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Location: Denmark/Herning

by Martin.dk

m68k wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2023 1:52 pm
Besides a lot of personal opinions in favor or against any bike brand, could we focus on what's coming next from Campagnol ?
So far it seems to be sure, that there should come a WRL Super Record for the 90ies aniversary.
Yes please. The fanboy fights are so annoying
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Roel W
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by Roel W

Vespasianus wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2023 5:04 pm
I don't think they want that. Potenza was a good choice but having two 11 speeds groups was confusing, even if one was rim brake only and one had a disc brake option. If you look at the current price structure, Chorus has moved a bit lower and is now the entry level Camapgnolo group and in that regard, is very competative. Campagnolo will not compete at the low end, and they should not. OEM will go to the cheaper chinese groupsets that are coming, not to Campag.
It depends how you define entry level.
A Campagnolo Chorus disc mechanical groupset (12-speed) is about 1400€
A Shimano disc R8000 Ultegra (11-speed) groupset is about 890€ (https://www.mantel.com/be/shimano-r8020 ... ec[]=18752).
Ultegra is considered second best. But still abour 1/3 cheaper as Campagnolo 'entry level'.
Although I do love Camapgnolo I would spend my money on Ultegra.
Vespasianus wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2023 5:04 pm
The lower priced EPS versions that I have tried (Athena 11 speed) have been dissapointing. If they do offer up another, non mechanical group, it should at least be as good if not better than the competetion. Shimano di2 shifts fast in the rear (as good as any top end mechanical system) and the front is just automatic- much better than any mechanical system. But I don't think we will ever see that. I could see a Record WPS but not a chorus.
I disagree.
I have a Athena 2010 groupset, the first affordable 11-speed groupset on the market. Internals of the Athena 2010 Ergopower are Record (check the part numbers in the spare parts catalogue).
This groupset has skeleton brakes, UltraTorque cranckset, Ultrashift Ergopowers,....and still works flawless.

But indeed let's keep the focus on 2023.
Rumors about the new Super Record WRL are quit clear. But will there be other news as well? Upgrade of mechanical groupsets? New gravel groupset?
Last edited by Roel W on Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:38 am, edited 1 time in total.

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ultimobici
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by ultimobici

Roel W wrote:
Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:17 am
I disagree.
I have a Athena 2010 groupset, the first affordable 11-speed groupset on the market. Internals of the Athena 2010 Ergopower are Record (check the part numbers in the spare parts catalogue).
This groupset has skeleton brakes, UltraTorque cranckset, Ultrashift Ergopowers,....and still works flawless.
True, the original Athena 11 was a great groupset. Sadly it shared too much with Chorus, so had to be dumbed down to separate it.

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