New Scott foil.. at last!

Back by popular demand, the general all-things Road forum!

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Ytse
Posts: 287
Joined: Thu May 05, 2022 11:53 am

by Ytse

snaxez wrote:
Wed Mar 29, 2023 5:23 am
Ytse wrote:
Fri Mar 17, 2023 7:55 am
How did you guys mount your Garmin Varia radar rear lights on the new Foil?
I use saddle mount from MagCad on my older foil. It`s solid, and looks good. https://www.magcad-designs.com/collecti ... ria-mounts
Cool, thanks!
2020 Scott Addict RC / 2021 Trek Emonda SLR / 2023 Specialized Tarmac SL8

Nereth
Posts: 250
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:18 am

by Nereth

PeytonM wrote:
Wed Mar 29, 2023 3:17 am
You could try silver anti seize, if I recall this was the trick on the old aeroads so the cones could be removed from the carbon seat post.
Would copper antiseize work the same way? I have some on hand.

by Weenie


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PeytonM
Posts: 196
Joined: Wed Apr 24, 2019 10:59 am

by PeytonM

Nereth wrote:
Wed Mar 29, 2023 7:01 am
PeytonM wrote:
Wed Mar 29, 2023 3:17 am
You could try silver anti seize, if I recall this was the trick on the old aeroads so the cones could be removed from the carbon seat post.
Would copper antiseize work the same way? I have some on hand.
Yep I'd give it a go

Jorisvc
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed May 03, 2017 10:31 pm

by Jorisvc

Anyone that also has issues with the seatpost on the new foil 2023. Mine was already broke after 7km... Scott says to use carbon pasta and tighten with 10nm. 10nm is very much in my opinion. The clamp broke the seatpost.

Nereth
Posts: 250
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:18 am

by Nereth

Jorisvc,

I have the full carbon post because I didn't want to bother with the grease.

The seat clamp - unlike saddle - has been mechanically excellent, tightens up and releases really smoothly and doesn't bind at all. Doesn't slip under gravity when loose either, which is cool.

I think the reason for the 10Nm is the larger than normal thread size on the bolt - larger diameter threads have more friction and a lower pitch - they generate less tension for a given torque so I wasn't surprised the spec was higher. Having said that I had been doing 9-9.5Nm because I usually run about 90% of rated on most pinch bolts on carbon, due to my distrust of torque as a tension setting mechanism.

No problems yet but have only done a single (~60km) ride. Based on your story, I will probably go home and test how well it holds at 5 and 10Nm, and maybe run it at 8 from now on if it holds OK at 5.

Jorisvc
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed May 03, 2017 10:31 pm

by Jorisvc

Nereth wrote:
Fri Mar 31, 2023 12:57 am
Jorisvc,

I have the full carbon post because I didn't want to bother with the grease.

The seat clamp - unlike saddle - has been mechanically excellent, tightens up and releases really smoothly and doesn't bind at all. Doesn't slip under gravity when loose either, which is cool.

I think the reason for the 10Nm is the larger than normal thread size on the bolt - larger diameter threads have more friction and a lower pitch - they generate less tension for a given torque so I wasn't surprised the spec was higher. Having said that I had been doing 9-9.5Nm because I usually run about 90% of rated on most pinch bolts on carbon, due to my distrust of torque as a tension setting mechanism.

No problems yet but have only done a single (~60km) ride. Based on your story, I will probably go home and test how well it holds at 5 and 10Nm, and maybe run it at 8 from now on if it holds OK at 5.

I also have the full carbon post... 380mm length. The original post was only 330 on the bike wich was too short.

Nereth
Posts: 250
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:18 am

by Nereth

Just checked torque and my post holds against me bashing the saddle with my fist, at 3 nm, with no carbon paste.

Added carbon paste and will run it at 8nm.

On a related note, frustrating that the shop not only failed to grease the saddle clamp, they also didn't carbon paste the seat post, both of which are in the manual.

Jorisvc
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed May 03, 2017 10:31 pm

by Jorisvc

Mine had grease on it but i seriously doubt if it was carbonpasta. :roll:

Indyx
Posts: 97
Joined: Sat Jun 17, 2017 3:31 am

by Indyx

Indyx wrote:
Sun Feb 12, 2023 1:59 am
sunfire2k5 wrote:
Thu Feb 09, 2023 7:55 pm
Hi there! anybody know if it possible to use the Addict cockpit for the Foil 2023 when waiting for the new AERO cockpit..? Is the cover / spacers compatible?
I have the same quesiton. I have a 2020 Addict RC with One piece Creston Handlebar.

I am considering buy the 23 Foil Frameset and swapping component. Curious if they work... ?

*Edit: Looks different... Bummer

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZ1HfaYfyL4&t=531s
Update on this? Anyone know if the Scott Foil 2022 Cockpit will fit on the 2023 Foil?

It looks like it might, if you use the 2023 Scott Foil Spacers. I am picking up a 23 foil this weekend, so I will find out!

Thanks

Nereth
Posts: 250
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:18 am

by Nereth

Hey gents, just following up with a photo of my completed build. Have ridden it a few times but only just cut the steerer so it's finally ready to photograph :D

Build is;

0) You can't get a frameset in my country, so;
1) Start with a 58cm RC30 - best paint colour. The wine red is semi-translucent and shows the carbon through it. Beautiful.
2) Throw out the 105, the wheels, the handlebar, the saddle, the seatpost.
3) DTSwiss Arc 1100 DB 80 wheels, tubeless with GP5000S TRs
4) Dura-ace 12 speed running gear
5) 54-40 chainrings. 11-34 in the back gives you the same easy-gear as a 52-36 with 11-30, but slightly more efficient. I find the 11-30 cassette is wastefully close together in 12 speed if I'm honest, so I don't feel I've lost anything there.
6) Power2Max NG 4-SL power meter
7) Enve SES Aero handlebars - 35 cm at the hoods. Tape wrapped only just past the hoods, with grip-tape on the top of the bars to allow firm invisible aerobars usage.
8) 160mm front, 140mm rear discs, instead of stock 160/160.
9) Add the non-flexy seatpost, in zero offset. Top with a prologo Dimension Tri to support an aggressive hip angle.

What has resulted is just about the fastest Mercx TT bike I can imagine. In terms of how it rides;

1) Probably not the all around best frame I've had - that goes to my S-Works Venge Disc on which I got cleaned up by a car 3 months ago.
2) Compared to that Venge, I think this will be aerodynamically faster, primarily due to the wheels, where the venge had Enve SES 5.6's. However the frame itself is likely similar in speed, though optimistically maybe 1-5 watts faster at 45kph based on tour test... Handlebar is the same on both bikes.
3) Compared to that venge though, the front end on the foil is noticeably flexier in a sprint. Not a problem for the way I ride it - primarily team time trials or longer 30s to 2 minute efforts, but it is noteworthy. The BB stiffness I can't tell the difference.
4) It may be stiffer in terms of seatpost compliance (with the solid seatpost, bear in mind), but I think it's been too long since I rode the Venge to be sure. It's probably at worst similar as the venge was also stiff.
5) Bike is 7.8kg as pictured but without pedals (with out-front mount, tubeless sealant in, etc).
20230407_132254.jpg

RDY
Posts: 2354
Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2020 10:31 pm

by RDY

Nereth wrote:
Fri Apr 07, 2023 11:17 am
Hey gents, just following up with a photo of my completed build. Have ridden it a few times but only just cut the steerer so it's finally ready to photograph :D

Build is;

0) You can't get a frameset in my country, so;
1) Start with a 58cm RC30 - best paint colour. The wine red is semi-translucent and shows the carbon through it. Beautiful.
2) Throw out the 105, the wheels, the handlebar, the saddle, the seatpost.
3) DTSwiss Arc 1100 DB 80 wheels, tubeless with GP5000S TRs
4) Dura-ace 12 speed running gear
5) 54-40 chainrings. 11-34 in the back gives you the same easy-gear as a 52-36 with 11-30, but slightly more efficient. I find the 11-30 cassette is wastefully close together in 12 speed if I'm honest, so I don't feel I've lost anything there.
6) Power2Max NG 4-SL power meter
7) Enve SES Aero handlebars - 35 cm at the hoods. Tape wrapped only just past the hoods, with grip-tape on the top of the bars to allow firm invisible aerobars usage.
8) 160mm front, 140mm rear discs, instead of stock 160/160.
9) Add the non-flexy seatpost, in zero offset. Top with a prologo Dimension Tri to support an aggressive hip angle.

What has resulted is just about the fastest Mercx TT bike I can imagine. In terms of how it rides;

1) Probably not the all around best frame I've had - that goes to my S-Works Venge Disc on which I got cleaned up by a car 3 months ago.
2) Compared to that Venge, I think this will be aerodynamically faster, primarily due to the wheels, where the venge had Enve SES 5.6's. However the frame itself is likely similar in speed, though optimistically maybe 1-5 watts faster at 45kph based on tour test... Handlebar is the same on both bikes.
3) Compared to that venge though, the front end on the foil is noticeably flexier in a sprint. Not a problem for the way I ride it - primarily team time trials or longer 30s to 2 minute efforts, but it is noteworthy. The BB stiffness I can't tell the difference.
4) It may be stiffer in terms of seatpost compliance (with the solid seatpost, bear in mind), but I think it's been too long since I rode the Venge to be sure. It's probably at worst similar as the venge was also stiff.
5) Bike is 7.8kg as pictured but without pedals (with out-front mount, tubeless sealant in, etc).
Didn't they make the bizzarre decision to go with a 1" steerer on the new Foil, after going 1 1/4" on the Addict and Addict Gravel? Not surprising if the front end lacks stiffness.

Bike looks great though.

Nereth
Posts: 250
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:18 am

by Nereth

Yep 1", I imagine to keep the head tube slim.

Low height of the stem doesn't help, likely has poor torsional stiffness.

RDY
Posts: 2354
Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2020 10:31 pm

by RDY

Nereth wrote:
Fri Apr 07, 2023 2:32 pm
Yep 1", I imagine to keep the head tube slim.

Low height of the stem doesn't help, likely has poor torsional stiffness.
It's such a pointless marginal gain though ... your knees are chopping away directly behind.

Nereth
Posts: 250
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:18 am

by Nereth

So I've been consistently frustrated with the flexyness of front end of the foil. Said flexyness does not seem to be reflected in the tour magazin tests, but then those tests would have been on a) the higher modulus frame b) the full carbon handlebar.

Doing a bit of pushing and prodding, I reckon it's the stock alloy stem that's incredibly flexy. If you look at it, it's got an incredibly thin profile vertically, like a bit of flat bar projecting out to the handlebars. In addition, the entire stem/spacer arrangement is incredibly wide laterally, despite the narrow 1" steerer in the core of it. By contrast, my venge has a 1 1/8" steerer but the whole arrangement is narrower.

So, I'm thinking of doing a silly thing and mounting the stem from my crashed venge onto it, using a 1" to 1 1/8" shim to account for the thin steerer, and using a 3d printed adaptor to smoothly narrow down from the foil-sized dust cover over the bearing to the venge-sized spacers that will then be mounted on top. I've already checked side by side and the cables actually run through exactly the same spot on both of them, so that should be pretty drama free...

If anyone has any reason to say I should stop this travesty right now before I start investing time into it... I'm listening...

Weaklegs
Posts: 11
Joined: Tue Dec 03, 2019 5:18 pm

by Weaklegs

I ve had foil 2019 disc, addict rc 2020 and just sold foil 2021...
During rides I could definietly feel a lot of movement and flex on the front/handlebar because of this thin like a finger steerer tube. I must say i didnt liked it epecially on bad quality tarmac when it was pronaunced. Read one or two reviews that complained about the same weak front stiffnes in newest foil, so now I em in doubt should I get newest Foil.

by Weenie


Visit starbike.com Online Retailer for HighEnd cycling components
Great Prices ✓    Broad Selection ✓    Worldwide Delivery ✓

www.starbike.com



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