New Scott foil.. at last!

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CAAD8FRED
Posts: 465
Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2018 10:52 pm

by CAAD8FRED

If Scott can make itself the luxury brand of cycling kind of like how people formerly viewed Pina or Factor before other brands prices caught up to them, then the price could be here to stay. But! If there's a bad downturn in the economy, these 16K bikes may be going for a deal if people have the disposable income to get them.

justkeepedaling
Posts: 1712
Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2008 6:14 am

by justkeepedaling

CAAD8FRED wrote:
Thu Jun 30, 2022 9:41 pm
montana05 wrote:
Thu Jun 30, 2022 9:31 pm
16000€? I bought my wife a second hand audi a3 last week for €17000......I guess I got ripped off.....
Does the A3 use state of the art HMX SL carbon fiber, does the A3 have an integrated steering column with electric paddle shifting? Didn't think so! You did get ripped off...

/s
But hey, it has hydraulic disc brakes, so it can't be all that bad...

These bike prices have me hoping that the new Propel or Soloist is remotely reasonable in pricing. Can't even think of anything else that would be carbon, somewhat aero, and in my pricepoint with 105 and not be a boat anchor

by Weenie


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aeroisnteverything
Posts: 893
Joined: Fri Aug 24, 2018 4:43 pm

by aeroisnteverything

justkeepedaling wrote:
Thu Jun 30, 2022 9:46 pm
CAAD8FRED wrote:
Thu Jun 30, 2022 9:41 pm
montana05 wrote:
Thu Jun 30, 2022 9:31 pm
16000€? I bought my wife a second hand audi a3 last week for €17000......I guess I got ripped off.....
Does the A3 use state of the art HMX SL carbon fiber, does the A3 have an integrated steering column with electric paddle shifting? Didn't think so! You did get ripped off...

/s
But hey, it has hydraulic disc brakes, so it can't be all that bad...

These bike prices have me hoping that the new Propel or Soloist is remotely reasonable in pricing. Can't even think of anything else that would be carbon, somewhat aero, and in my pricepoint with 105 and not be a boat anchor
Propel might be ok-ish. Then there is still Canyon, Cube, Rose who are somewhat more sensible, even if they also raised their prices. Aeroad CFR is like 40% cheaper than this Scott. And Aeroad CFR frameset comes for a price less than other top tier frames, while including shifters, cockpit and brake calipers in the package. Yes, the bike has had some issues, but it is still very fast and light, so if you are after function over brand, then there is that option to consider.

PeytonM
Posts: 196
Joined: Wed Apr 24, 2019 10:59 am

by PeytonM

justkeepedaling wrote:
Thu Jun 30, 2022 9:46 pm
CAAD8FRED wrote:
Thu Jun 30, 2022 9:41 pm
montana05 wrote:
Thu Jun 30, 2022 9:31 pm
16000€? I bought my wife a second hand audi a3 last week for €17000......I guess I got ripped off.....
Does the A3 use state of the art HMX SL carbon fiber, does the A3 have an integrated steering column with electric paddle shifting? Didn't think so! You did get ripped off...

/s
But hey, it has hydraulic disc brakes, so it can't be all that bad...

These bike prices have me hoping that the new Propel or Soloist is remotely reasonable in pricing. Can't even think of anything else that would be carbon, somewhat aero, and in my pricepoint with 105 and not be a boat anchor
If your outside the US, I just picked up a Merida Reacto with ultegra mechanical, it's heavy (standard wheels are 2kg) but is proving to be a great riding bike for cheap. I was coming from a canyon ultimate with 6800 di2 but after an accident needed a new bike fast. Initially worried about going back to mechanical but it's been a non issue.

Roadbiker10
Posts: 495
Joined: Fri Apr 30, 2021 8:22 am

by Roadbiker10

This design is definitely a departure from the old Foil, which never was good looking nor very fast in aero tests as I remember. Tastes differ greatly so I understand if some don't agree.
Scott Addict RC 20 2021
Ridley Kanzo Adventure 2022

Roadbiker10
Posts: 495
Joined: Fri Apr 30, 2021 8:22 am

by Roadbiker10

Is there any benefit to the SL frame other than weight?
Scott Addict RC 20 2021
Ridley Kanzo Adventure 2022

Roadbiker10
Posts: 495
Joined: Fri Apr 30, 2021 8:22 am

by Roadbiker10

citadelguard wrote:
Thu Jun 30, 2022 4:38 pm
Mocs123 wrote:
Thu Jun 30, 2022 12:56 pm
rainerhq wrote:
Thu Jun 30, 2022 9:00 am
Only Ultimate and Pro have integrated handlebars. Very disapointing. Win every ride :o :o
Pardon my ignorance, but what's the advantage of a one peice bar/stem combo over a seperate bar and stem? Obviously they look good, but they generally don't seem perticularly light and don't offer as much adjustability.
AERO
That depends on what kind of stem bar combination it is. This combination looks pretty aero to me. Weight is obviously lower on the onepiece though.

I don't think it's worth it though, unless you know your position exactly and you know you will never change reach. Even then, you can't adjust pitch, which can be limiting. Then you have the issue of width. If you want a narrower bar with a longer stem, it's almost never possible. If you can't get narrow bars in the length you need, then the aero advantage is negated.

I think they should offer a two piece bar and stem which is high end as an option as well. The stem can be carbon in combination with a quality fast aero bar.
Scott Addict RC 20 2021
Ridley Kanzo Adventure 2022

TLN
Posts: 630
Joined: Wed Jul 12, 2017 4:50 pm

by TLN

Roadbiker10 wrote:
Fri Jul 01, 2022 2:14 pm
That depends on what kind of stem bar combination it is. This combination looks pretty aero to me. Weight is obviously lower on the onepiece though.

I don't think it's worth it though, unless you know your position exactly and you know you will never change reach. Even then, you can't adjust pitch, which can be limiting. Then you have the issue of width. If you want a narrower bar with a longer stem, it's almost never possible. If you can't get narrow bars in the length you need, then the aero advantage is negated.

I think they should offer a two piece bar and stem which is high end as an option as well. The stem can be carbon in combination with a quality fast aero bar.
To add to that, barstem or separate bar plus stem should be possible to move up and down, i.e. remove some spacers from underneath the bar and place em on top. Some brands route cables and makeing that (almost) impossible: Parlee RZ7, Allied Echo, others prohibit installaton of spacers on top of the frame.
His: Orbea Orca OMX
Hers: Cannondale Synapse HM Disc

Roadbiker10
Posts: 495
Joined: Fri Apr 30, 2021 8:22 am

by Roadbiker10

TLN wrote:
Fri Jul 01, 2022 2:20 pm
Roadbiker10 wrote:
Fri Jul 01, 2022 2:14 pm
That depends on what kind of stem bar combination it is. This combination looks pretty aero to me. Weight is obviously lower on the onepiece though.

I don't think it's worth it though, unless you know your position exactly and you know you will never change reach. Even then, you can't adjust pitch, which can be limiting. Then you have the issue of width. If you want a narrower bar with a longer stem, it's almost never possible. If you can't get narrow bars in the length you need, then the aero advantage is negated.

I think they should offer a two piece bar and stem which is high end as an option as well. The stem can be carbon in combination with a quality fast aero bar.
To add to that, barstem or separate bar plus stem should be possible to move up and down, i.e. remove some spacers from underneath the bar and place em on top. Some brands route cables and makeing that (almost) impossible: Parlee RZ7, Allied Echo, others prohibit installaton of spacers on top of the frame.
On the Addict RC, it's easy to remove spacers and add regular round ones on top. But then you have to ride without the cap. From what I remember Scott say that you should not ride with spacers on top other than just trying out the position and then you have to cut the steerer. I've been riding mine with 2cm spacers on top without the cap for 3 months now. Since I'm not sure about my postion yet and I don't want to pay for the shop to cut it twice.
Scott Addict RC 20 2021
Ridley Kanzo Adventure 2022

TLN
Posts: 630
Joined: Wed Jul 12, 2017 4:50 pm

by TLN

Roadbiker10 wrote:
Fri Jul 01, 2022 2:40 pm
On the Addict RC, it's easy to remove spacers and add regular round ones on top. But then you have to ride without the cap. From what I remember Scott say that you should not ride with spacers on top other than just trying out the position and then you have to cut the steerer. I've been riding mine with 2cm spacers on top without the cap for 3 months now. Since I'm not sure about my postion yet and I don't want to pay for the shop to cut it twice.
Some companies say you cannot use it with spacers on top (Scott, Orca) and some brands that make it almost impossible: Allied Echo, Parlee RZ7.
Ideally I'd like to have both options: Stem (multiple angles) + Bar (Branded or my own one) and barstem with identical specs to comapnys Bar + Stem, probably in most agressive stem angle. And have ability to adjust (bar)stem up or down, i.e. ride it with spacers

I know BMC got system like that before (Pre 2020): two angles of ICS bar, Teammachine with single headset cover, Roadmachine with two headset covers, both are less aggressive compared to Teammachince, Slim aero bar with matching stem and complete Barstem that was released later, but still could be adapted to older bikes.
His: Orbea Orca OMX
Hers: Cannondale Synapse HM Disc

Roadbiker10
Posts: 495
Joined: Fri Apr 30, 2021 8:22 am

by Roadbiker10

Yeah I agree. There should be more options. It's tough with proprietary parts and they cost a ton too whenever you need to change something.
Scott Addict RC 20 2021
Ridley Kanzo Adventure 2022

tommyboyo
Posts: 350
Joined: Sun Jun 21, 2020 12:49 am

by tommyboyo

aeroisnteverything wrote:
Thu Jun 30, 2022 7:04 pm
justkeepedaling wrote:
Thu Jun 30, 2022 6:48 pm
raven14 wrote:
Thu Jun 30, 2022 5:55 pm
Prices are also online, at least on the Belgian website. 16k euro for the Ultimate, 11k for the Pro.

That's ridiculous. 16k Euro what in the hell???
It's totally bananas.

I think the manufacturers have been very spoilt by the ever increasing demand during Covid period, where ppl (1) found themselves with more time to train due to working remotely more; (2) could not go out and travel so just splurged on stuff, including bikes and bike-related accessories; and (3) often got extra dosh from government stimulus/furlough or other support programs or otherwise got raises at work as the economy was chugging along nicely. This has led to some misplaced ideas about what the industry can sustain in terms of pricing and demand structure going forward. I have already heard that the manufacturers of cycling clothing in particular are having a torrid time this year. Ditto for bike shops generally. Consumer confdence is down, inflation is up in the way that hurts spending power, it's "back to the office" time in a lot of places, etc. etc. If things get even worse economy-wise, as is the expectation now, the sales of these overpriced pieces of plastic will go through the floor. Will see what happens to pricing in that environment.

The idea that everyone in the industry can sell a complete bike for a whole lot more money than an (expensive!) new italian motorcycle and also more than an economy car, is just bonkers. It works if there is some perception of exclusivity or for brands that can command a luxury premium for one reason or another, but it cannot work for everyone.
Best post I have read in ages.

Chapeau.

RDY
Posts: 2355
Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2020 10:31 pm

by RDY

Safa's riding it in Madeira currently.

Scott should have got rid of their laughable marketing mumbo jumbo (and team responsible) and just commissioned more videos of him ridiing it.

neomoz
Posts: 173
Joined: Tue Jan 19, 2010 1:38 am

by neomoz

The redesign reminds me a lot of the cervelo S5. It doesn't scream to me like a revolution in design, it's just taking what's known to work years ago and overcharge for it. This industry man...

by Weenie


Visit starbike.com Online Retailer for HighEnd cycling components
Great Prices ✓    Broad Selection ✓    Worldwide Delivery ✓

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TobinHatesYou
Posts: 12456
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

neomoz wrote:
Sat Jul 02, 2022 1:26 am
The redesign reminds me a lot of the cervelo S5. It doesn't scream to me like a revolution in design, it's just taking what's known to work years ago and overcharge for it. This industry man...

They've done a few interesting tweaks like the seatstays are bent toward the trailing edge of the wheel to funnel air back over the deep section rather than just leave it as a turbulent wake. The HT and BB are obviously chunkier than the UCI previously allowed. The seatpost design is what Canyon should have done on the Aeroad. The fork crown sits incredibly high relative to the BB.

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