*Tour Aero Bike Tests*

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Alastair2308
Posts: 108
Joined: Mon Feb 24, 2020 7:16 am

by Alastair2308

justkeepedaling wrote:
Fri Jan 13, 2023 11:56 pm
Alastair2308 wrote:
Fri Jan 13, 2023 6:52 pm
Has Tour done a test of the Felt AR Disk? The rim brake AR if I remember correct was one of the best tested bikes at the time.
Yes, although maybe not for the very latest disc model. The results are in this thread, you just have to dig for it. Last I saw, it was slower than the rim by a few Watts
I haven't seen anything in here about it. I'll have a squizz through the thread. I've also checked tours website. Maybe I didn't go back far enough.

Alastair2308
Posts: 108
Joined: Mon Feb 24, 2020 7:16 am

by Alastair2308

justkeepedaling wrote:
Fri Jan 13, 2023 11:56 pm
Alastair2308 wrote:
Fri Jan 13, 2023 6:52 pm
Has Tour done a test of the Felt AR Disk? The rim brake AR if I remember correct was one of the best tested bikes at the time.
Yes, although maybe not for the very latest disc model. The results are in this thread, you just have to dig for it. Last I saw, it was slower than the rim by a few Watts
I checked tour and I read this thread through. I can only find reference to the rim brake model.

Anyways how I plan to build up mine it should be MUCH lighter than stock (built ARs with Ultegra are in the ~8kg range) for starters I am binning the craptastic CHONKtastic stock stem that the Felt comes with. That honken pig of a stem weighs in at 273g on my scales and it's an all carbon construction. I'll be keeping the stem still fairly aero but still fairly traditional by going for a Ritchey Chicane. To maintain the internal cable routing I'll adapt the standard stem adapter spacer, with holes to route the cables. Or I'll 3D print my own. Handlebars will be 3T Aeroflux in 38cm as small as I could get in the 3T. Wheels. Light Bicycle AR56s (RR56C02) I'm keeping weight down as well by using TRP Spyre SLC mechanical disks on standard mechanical Shifters with compressionless brake housings to make sure the mech disks are strong enough.

With all that in mind. Im targeting 7.5kg in a 54.
And it should be more areo than stock thanks to the smaller frontal profile afforded by the slimmer stem.

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calleking
Posts: 386
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 3:20 pm

by calleking

I found a reference to the Felt AR FRD from January 2016 with Zipp 404 "FS C". It says it is the disc version and it tested at 205W but it is missing a lot of data points.

The rim brake model was tested February 2015 at 210W.
2022 Wilier Filante SLR Dura-Ace/Ultegra Di2 12sp
2021 Cannondale Scalpel Carbon 2

Retired:
2018 S-Works Tarmac SL6 Sagan Superstar DA 9150
2016 Aeroad CF SLX UDi2
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RDY
Posts: 2358
Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2020 10:31 pm

by RDY

RNAV wrote:
Fri Jan 13, 2023 7:17 pm
Will Tour ever test the Factor Ostro? Any reason why they haven't?
Generally they'll test what the brands send them. If Factor sent them an Ostro they'd test it unless they were specifically forbade from doing so - in which case they probably wouldn't agree to review it. Which could be the issue ... Factor are probably not keen on it being compared to the One.

Alastair2308
Posts: 108
Joined: Mon Feb 24, 2020 7:16 am

by Alastair2308

calleking wrote:
Sun Jan 15, 2023 5:52 pm
I found a reference to the Felt AR FRD from January 2016 with Zipp 404 "FS C". It says it is the disc version and it tested at 205W but it is missing a lot of data points.

The rim brake model was tested February 2015 at 210W.
Yeah I am building on the new disk frameset. A few changes. The seatstays dropped slightly and are more smoothly intergrated into the frame. The seattube looks alot deeper. The down tube uses a kammtail.

mrlobber
Posts: 1928
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2010 9:36 am
Location: Where the permanent autumn is

by mrlobber

calleking wrote:
Sun Jan 15, 2023 5:52 pm
I found a reference to the Felt AR FRD from January 2016 with Zipp 404 "FS C". It says it is the disc version and it tested at 205W but it is missing a lot of data points.

The rim brake model was tested February 2015 at 210W.
Something is off here. The AR disc was launched in 2020, so Tour definitely could not test the disc version in 2016. And the 205W figure is long known to be for the rim version (equal to the 2nd gen S5 rim).
Minimum bike categories required in the stable:
Aero bike | GC bike | GC rim bike | Climbing bike | Climbing rim bike | Classics bike | Gravel bike | TT bike | Indoors bike

Alastair2308
Posts: 108
Joined: Mon Feb 24, 2020 7:16 am

by Alastair2308

mrlobber wrote:
Sun Jan 15, 2023 9:02 pm
calleking wrote:
Sun Jan 15, 2023 5:52 pm
I found a reference to the Felt AR FRD from January 2016 with Zipp 404 "FS C". It says it is the disc version and it tested at 205W but it is missing a lot of data points.

The rim brake model was tested February 2015 at 210W.
Something is off here. The AR disc was launched in 2020, so Tour definitely could not test the disc version in 2016. And the 205W figure is long known to be for the rim version (equal to the 2nd gen S5 rim).
yes those numbers are for the rim FRD. I'd love to know how the disk version stacks up. Although I am sure it will be impressive. Felt knows their Aero. The only place I see it loosing watts is the uber fat oversized stem.

calleking
Posts: 386
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 3:20 pm

by calleking

Yep, I think the numbers are for the rim version. In the spreadsheet I have there's a comment about it being the disc version but it doesn't add up.
2022 Wilier Filante SLR Dura-Ace/Ultegra Di2 12sp
2021 Cannondale Scalpel Carbon 2

Retired:
2018 S-Works Tarmac SL6 Sagan Superstar DA 9150
2016 Aeroad CF SLX UDi2
2016 CAAD12 - SRAM Red 22 - Hyper 50mm

oik01
Posts: 1
Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2021 1:36 am

by oik01

Does tour magazine issue an english translation version? Have they tested the new madone or are there any plans for testing it? Lastly, how does the tarmac SL7 compare to the pure aero bikes like the madone and aeroad?

ichobi
Posts: 1794
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:30 pm

by ichobi

Tour no longer publishes english version but if you buy the german version you could very quickly use your phone apps to have it translated instantly. I do this all the time and it works like a charm.

Tarmac is just a few watts slower than the aeroad cfr. It’s one of the fastest “all round” bike if you still consider it to fit that category.


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spdntrxi
Posts: 5791
Joined: Sat Jul 20, 2013 6:11 pm

by spdntrxi

SL7 was I think 210
Aeroad was 204
New Scott Foil 206
New Giant Propel 209
BMC TimeMachine 210
2022 Cervelo S5 was 205
2023 Cervelo S5=???
I have not seen a number for Gen7 Madone yet
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mrlobber
Posts: 1928
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2010 9:36 am
Location: Where the permanent autumn is

by mrlobber

spdntrxi wrote:
Mon Jan 16, 2023 7:02 am
New Scott Foil 206
Very interesting, TBH, I thought it should have performed better, especially given that Tour usually seemed to give slight edge to Scott bikes too (like half German :D)
Minimum bike categories required in the stable:
Aero bike | GC bike | GC rim bike | Climbing bike | Climbing rim bike | Classics bike | Gravel bike | TT bike | Indoors bike

Roadbiker10
Posts: 495
Joined: Fri Apr 30, 2021 8:22 am

by Roadbiker10

mrlobber wrote:
Mon Jan 16, 2023 9:11 am
spdntrxi wrote:
Mon Jan 16, 2023 7:02 am
New Scott Foil 206
Very interesting, TBH, I thought it should have performed better, especially given that Tour usually seemed to give slight edge to Scott bikes too (like half German :D)
Didn't both the old Foil and the Addict get poor results?
Scott Addict RC 20 2021
Ridley Kanzo Adventure 2022

calleking
Posts: 386
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 3:20 pm

by calleking

Roadbiker10 wrote:
Mon Jan 16, 2023 10:26 am
mrlobber wrote:
Mon Jan 16, 2023 9:11 am
spdntrxi wrote:
Mon Jan 16, 2023 7:02 am
New Scott Foil 206
Very interesting, TBH, I thought it should have performed better, especially given that Tour usually seemed to give slight edge to Scott bikes too (like half German :D)
Didn't both the old Foil and the Addict get poor results?
Year tested in parenthesis.

206W - Disc Scott Foil RC Ultimate - (2022, Zipp 454 NSW)
211W - Rim Scott Foil Premium - (2016, Zipp 404)
2015W - Disc Scott Foil Premium - (2018, Zipp 303NSW so maybe a few watts less with 404 like most numbers are based on)
2019W - Disc Scott Addict RC Premium - (2020, DT Swiss ERC 1100)

I would suggest subscribing to the Tour Magazine like mentioned above. There's a lot of stuff that are more important than data points and it helps them continue with these tests that are much more than the usual "feels very stiff and fast" journalism that is allover the internet :wink:

There's also stiffness numbers from Fork, BB, head tube and even seat post flex in the articles :thumbup:
2022 Wilier Filante SLR Dura-Ace/Ultegra Di2 12sp
2021 Cannondale Scalpel Carbon 2

Retired:
2018 S-Works Tarmac SL6 Sagan Superstar DA 9150
2016 Aeroad CF SLX UDi2
2016 CAAD12 - SRAM Red 22 - Hyper 50mm

by Weenie


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Roadbiker10
Posts: 495
Joined: Fri Apr 30, 2021 8:22 am

by Roadbiker10

calleking wrote:
Mon Jan 16, 2023 12:32 pm
Roadbiker10 wrote:
Mon Jan 16, 2023 10:26 am
mrlobber wrote:
Mon Jan 16, 2023 9:11 am
spdntrxi wrote:
Mon Jan 16, 2023 7:02 am
New Scott Foil 206
Very interesting, TBH, I thought it should have performed better, especially given that Tour usually seemed to give slight edge to Scott bikes too (like half German :D)
Didn't both the old Foil and the Addict get poor results?
Year tested in parenthesis.

206W - Disc Scott Foil RC Ultimate - (2022, Zipp 454 NSW)
211W - Rim Scott Foil Premium - (2016, Zipp 404)
2015W - Disc Scott Foil Premium - (2018, Zipp 303NSW so maybe a few watts less with 404 like most numbers are based on)
2019W - Disc Scott Addict RC Premium - (2020, DT Swiss ERC 1100)

I would suggest subscribing to the Tour Magazine like mentioned above. There's a lot of stuff that are more important than data points and it helps them continue with these tests that are much more than the usual "feels very stiff and fast" journalism that is allover the internet :wink:

There's also stiffness numbers from Fork, BB, head tube and even seat post flex in the articles :thumbup:
Thanks. Is 211W that great for an aero rim brake frame though? I don't remember seeing the Foil in the top 10 people used to post.

I was thinking about the 229W figure the Addict got, but that was with stock wheels and tires. 35mm Syncros wheels and 28 tires. At 219W that's pretty good I'd say. Is that with 45mm ERC? Although still far of the SL7. Probably none of the semi aero bikes are close to SL7 as far as I know. I haven't followed this thread lately though.

Regarding stifness and such. I remember the Addict being one of the less stiff ones in that list I saw. But of course, it's not as easy as the stiffest being the best. The pros race endurance and not purely sprinting. So it's more about striking a balance than being as stiff as possible. I have an Addict RC and it's actually a great comfortable bike.

Has anyone compliled a list maybe of the fastest non aero bikes? I would like to know how the Addict compares right now. It's nice to see that they did a good job on the new Foil.
Scott Addict RC 20 2021
Ridley Kanzo Adventure 2022

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