Campagnolo 12-Speed

[Zorka]

When I adjust the cable tension to get the chain onto the largest cog, the chain can get down to the smallest sprocket, but is very loud across the range and doesn´t jump between cogs easily (sometimes takes 2 clicks to shift down).

The chain length looks correct from the photos. These derailleurs are super sensitive to B-screw setting, but even if not set properly it should not cause these issues you describe.
Please try setting the shifting as per Campy instructions (5th cog) and make sure the low limit screw is not getting in the way wheun shifting to 32. If this won't help I'd look at the hanger.

I tried the shifting with limit screws loosen and 5th cog perfectly aligned, but with no luck. The B-screw could be loosened even more as per Campy instructions (the lower chain branch must not face upwards) but I don´t think this will help the mech to shift on the 32 cog.

[cauxxx]

hi guys,
i looking for the answer but not found yet with long term review,
1. is anyone here tried using 12s shimano cassette on campy 12s? i using 12s chorus db
2. what kind brakepad and rotor can fit chorus 12s? original campy seems pricy to me,
thanks before

de rosa merak 2020

You’re concerned about the cost of pads & rotors but stumped up top dollar for a Merak? Wow!


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[cauxxx]

You’re concerned about the cost of pads & rotors but stumped up top dollar for a Merak? Wow!

To be fair, the Campag DB310 pads go for £30-£40 per pair in UK which is painful for a wear item. After market pads are available especially if you search for pads for Magura MT2/4/6/8 which fit campag calipers. I note that at least for Ekar brakes you need pads with a spring.

I call BS. While DB-310 have a RRP of £39, but Shimano aren't far behind at £35. But Chorus/Ekar rotors are cheaper than their Shimano equivalent. For that matter AFS rotors for Record & Super Record are also cheaper than those same rotors. Cassettes are slightly more expensive, but in my experience they last longer than Shimano ones. Swapping out any of the above is a false economy IMO as you're comromising on performance to save a few quid. Also, running a Shimano cassette and or chain on a Campagnolo system is likely to accelerate wear negating any savings on their initial purchase.

Campagnolo road pads are a bit more expensive but you can get cheaper Magura or other forms that work fine. EKAR pads with the spring are easier but for $40 they last a good long time. Again, I find Campagnolo stuff to just be a better quality and to last longer.

thanks for opinion guys, i think just campy user rare in indonesia. thats make more expensive than shimano.
i got point for put shimano in campy system. maybe cheaper, but its last faster. just the same

[gorkypl]

I tried the shifting with limit screws loosen and 5th cog perfectly aligned, but with no luck. The B-screw could be loosened even more as per Campy instructions (the lower chain branch must not face upwards) but I don´t think this will help the mech to shift on the 32 cog.

If it works perfectly when on small ring front and does not work when on big ring (as you described) then chain tension might be the reason, so unscrewing B screw might be worth trying.
It is also possible that the hanger is outside Campy spec, putting RD in a wrong angle. This can also be remediated to some point by B screw adjustment.

[Yoaqim]

Great to hear back from someone using the same direct mount hanger.
Unfortunately I don´t have the original Canyon hanger. What´s more I broke the Sigeyi hanger this weekend (crash during race) so have to order one soon, either Canyon or Sigeyi.
But I like the stiffness of Sigeyi and it did it´s job to protect the frame and derailleur in crash. TBH it looks much better quality than original Canyon hanger which is easy to bent.

Bendability of the Canyon hangers is a feature, not a bug. The hangers are made from a rel soft alloy to provide a breaking point to protect the dropout from fraction by impact of sudden force. When mounting the new hanger please use a hanger alignment tool to ensure the derailleur is pefectly aligned with the cassette.

[NickB]

I tried the shifting with limit screws loosen and 5th cog perfectly aligned, but with no luck. The B-screw could be loosened even more as per Campy instructions (the lower chain branch must not face upwards) but I don´t think this will help the mech to shift on the 32 cog.

If it works perfectly when on small ring front and does not work when on big ring (as you described) then chain tension might be the reason, so unscrewing B screw might be worth trying.
It is also possible that the hanger is outside Campy spec, putting RD in a wrong angle. This can also be remediated to some point by B screw adjustment.

I had murders with OK on small not big front ring and visa versa with Potenza. The reason, SRAM cassette. Put a Centaur on after changing freehub and perfect. I have had success with Shimano 11-30 since but no amount of SRAM ones played ball. Bit off topic but someone might find this one day..

[graeme_f_k]

When I adjust the cable tension to get the chain onto the largest cog, the chain can get down to the smallest sprocket, but is very loud across the range and doesn´t jump between cogs easily (sometimes takes 2 clicks to shift down).

Yes, maximum smoothness cableset was used. The cable moves very smoothly in the housing and the loop is big enough I think.

Not sure if there is much else I could suggest. If the cable is fine and the upper pully aligns with the small cog then the RD hanger may be an issue. The Campy 12s setup seems (unsurprisingly) more sensitive to this than 11s.

Could be alignment, or maybe something not quite right in the setup linking the RD to the DM hanger. If you have the parts trying the normal non-DM hanger would be a good next step.

No problem mate. Cableset is almost new and smallest cog is aligned perfectly. I also think the hanger was maybe a bit bent, but I have to order new one (see my previous post).
Maybe I´ll order non-DM hanger from Canyon first (it´s cheaper than Sigeyi) and try the shifting.
Another thing I heard about is the spacer behind the Campy 12s cassette. No info from Campagnolo directly, but for example Mavic hub requires to install 0.55mm spacer behind Campy cassette.

With stuff like this, go right back to the beginning and make sure that you have all the basics right - you can chase your tail for hours looking for a problem when it's something really fundamental that'll mean you can never get the set up 100% right.

The Mavic wheel issue is not covered in Campagnolo's literature - however, if you measure from the inside of the hanger to the centre-line of the smallest sprocket with the cassette fitted with no spacer, on a Mavic cassette body, you will see that the cassette sits slightly too far inboard as a result of the Mavic hub design. With the 11s Athena triple system, it used to be a routine thing, to add a 0.5 - 1mm spacer (depending on the starting sprocket size on the cassette) to get good indexing across the whole cassette.

So - to bring the 12s cassette into the position that the system is designed for, you will possibly need the spacer. The shorter the rear triangle of the frame, the greater the need to pay attention to detail like this.

Make sure the cassette locking is at 40nm.

Check the cassette body for "rock". Many of the Mavic cassette bodies are notorious for developing "rock". Any cassette body can do this of course - bearing wear will produce it, as can, in the case of a Campagnolo wheel / cassette body, a loose cassette body fixing nut.

Make sure that the wheel really is in the frame all the way - if it's through axle, that's not likely to be an issue but with QR, it's worth a check. If the wheel isn't properly vertical in the frame, the cassette is automatically misaligned relative to the hanger and to the RD.

Make absolutely sure that the lever end of the cable outer, under the tape, is fully engaged into the socket on the lever. If you have already taped the bars, put the bike into the biggest sprocket to maximise cable tension, then release the Torx screw that holds the lever to the bar and push the lever body hard "upwards" to make sure of the outer cable engagement. You only need a very small gap to develop between the end of the cable outer and the floor of the lever port, to cause issues, which will be worst at the "big" end of the cassette when you are on the big chainring, as the rear gear cable tension here is at it's highest, since the natural chainline as well as the RD spring are both trying to pull the chain off the biggest sprocket & both are resisting the chain going onto it, if the chain is on the penultimate sprocket.

If you haven't taped the bars, my preference is to fully insulation-tape the outers all the way up to where you terminate the bar tape, assuming the cables are external to the bars - not the usual 3, rather loose (IME) points at lever exit, bar curve and part way along the tops. If you anchor the outers like this, shift adjustment is more accurate and tends to stay "done", once done. I know of WW guys that will bemoan the extra 20g or so of sparky tape but saving that 20g or so only really matters once everything is working to spec ... and stays that way.

Check all the cable anchorages in the frame. We have seen some problems with pliable plastic guides taking the cables into the frame where guide distortion has caused shifting issues. TBF, we used to occasionally see this on 11s, too.

Use all original, metal, ferrules - the type with a "tail" - to minimise friction under tension at the point where the cable crosses into the frame. Cable motion can feel smooth when you test it with your hand but the RD puts just over a 1kg "pull" on the cable and that can convert a cable from being completely smooth, to not-so-smooth.

Once you have the indexing very close to right, hold Lever 2 across to "lock" the shifter internals and if you have any exposed gear inner, give it a gentle (around 1.5kg) pull to make sure the outer is properly seated in all the ferrules, then re-check adjustment. Otherwise, gently operate Lever 2 a couple of times, without the pedals turning - but do it very progressively - you don't want to strain the composite at the base of the lever.

If you have "California-Crossed" - don't, unless the frame and it's cable guides were specifically designed for it - it varies a little from frame to frame but it can be a source of friction.

Check that the hanger is properly tight to the frame - a lot of people neglect to check the fixing bolts / screws and again,with the chain fully crossed big-big, that's the time that the hanger is most likely to move.

As others have said, check the hanger spec. It's unlikely to be far adrift but I think you mentioned it's not the OE hanger and third parties do all sorts of weird things.

The b-screw adjustment is a balancing act with 12s. It's a competition on many frames between the normally used "H" dimension of 5-7mm on the biggest sprocket / small chainring (though on mechanical 12s this spacing is the same on both rings) and the chain wrap at the smallest sprocket. When in doubt, the chain wrap at the smallest sprocket should "win", that is to say, the chain from top jockey exit to smallest sprocket entry should either be parallel to the floor, at the highest degree of wrap, or run, as you look at it from the drive side, low on the right, where the chain exits the index pulley, to higher on the left, where it enters the smallest sprocket.

[Miller]

Changing topic slightly, if I want to put a 12sp cassette onto an N3W freehub using the little adapter, do I need a deeper cassette locking? As the N3W freehub is about 4mm shorter than the previous freehub designs.

[ultimobici]

Changing topic slightly, if I want to put a 12sp cassette onto an N3W freehub using the little adapter, do I need a deeper cassette locking? As the N3W freehub is about 4mm shorter than the previous freehub designs.

https://www.campagnolo.com/UK/en/Suppor ... _installed


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[InoxEPS]

Campagnolo 12-speed = It takes patience to adjust

[Miller]

https://www.campagnolo.com/UK/en/Suppor ... _installed

Thanks, the very thing. So that's a yes then.

[ultimobici]

Campagnolo 12-speed = It takes patience to adjust

Really? Just install it properly with the correct inners & outers, making sure the ends are cut cleanly. Not rocket science.


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[InoxEPS]

Campagnolo 12-speed = It takes patience to adjust

Really? Just install it properly with the correct inners & outers, making sure the ends are cut cleanly. Not rocket science.

I mean the B-screw ( H )

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[fdegrove]

Hi,

Campagnolo 12-speed = It takes patience to adjust

Really? Just install it properly with the correct inners & outers, making sure the ends are cut cleanly. Not rocket science.

I mean the B-screw ( H )

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Running a SR 12S and a RE 12S for the moment without any isssues at all.
It even runs just fine with the older cable system (10S and 11S era), no problem.
As said above, no rocket science.

Cheers,

[Zorka]

I tried the shifting with limit screws loosen and 5th cog perfectly aligned, but with no luck. The B-screw could be loosened even more as per Campy instructions (the lower chain branch must not face upwards) but I don´t think this will help the mech to shift on the 32 cog.

If it works perfectly when on small ring front and does not work when on big ring (as you described) then chain tension might be the reason, so unscrewing B screw might be worth trying.
It is also possible that the hanger is outside Campy spec, putting RD in a wrong angle. This can also be remediated to some point by B screw adjustment.

I´ll try to loose the B-screw to the point the lower chain branch will be almost parallel with upper chain. I have to wait few days more for the new hanger.
I believe the Sigeyi DM hanger is withing Campy spec, I measured it before installing.