BikeRadar tests tires at Silverstone - Results contradict BCRR

[maurice1]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vs1jOVdYgbc
For once, bikeradar seems to have produced a truly independent and well isolated test
The testing rig at silverstone lab looks pretty thorough, yet the results don't align with the bicyclerollingresistance tests many of us trust as the gold standard of independent tests and use as a buying guide.
10 psi difference and no doubt other variables such as tube, but there is no common trend.
28mm STR is 5 watts slower, corsa pro TLR almost 7w slower, p zero race TLR 1w faster (26mm on bcrr), etc...

What do you think? Who do you trust?

[BalticSea]

Well, BCRR tests do not really correlate with real world, so I'd trust bikeradar over them.

Everyone knows that Contis are fast on steel drum, but harsh on real roads. That's their downfall.

[mrlobber]

Well, BCRR tests do not really correlate with real world, so I'd trust bikeradar over them.

It has been verified multiple times that BRR/Aerocoach and some other similar tests correlate well with real road performance, i.e., faster tyres in those tests are faster also in real world.

[BalticSea]

Well, BCRR tests do not really correlate with real world, so I'd trust bikeradar over them.

It has been verified multiple times that BRR/Aerocoach and some other similar tests correlate well with real road performance, i.e., faster tyres in those tests are faster also in real world.

Verified by whom using what kind of methodology?

Sure, GP5ks are faster than Gatorskins both in real world and in BCRR tests. But if you were to follow BCRR, you'd think that Contis are faster tyre on the road, which is simply not the case. BCRR also suggests that high pressures are faster, which isn't necessarily true either.

[TobinHatesYou]

Well, BCRR tests do not really correlate with real world, so I'd trust bikeradar over them.

It has been verified multiple times that BRR/Aerocoach and some other similar tests correlate well with real road performance, i.e., faster tyres in those tests are faster also in real world.

Verified by whom using what kind of methodology?

Sure, GP5ks are faster than Gatorskins both in real world and in BCRR tests. But if you were to follow BCRR, you'd think that Contis are faster tyre on the road, which is simply not the case. BCRR also suggests that high pressures are faster, which isn't necessarily true either.

You do realize that the Silverstone Lab uses a smooth drum, right?

I trust BRR and Aerocoach over BikeRadar.

[BigBoyND]

Well, BCRR tests do not really correlate with real world, so I'd trust bikeradar over them.

It has been verified multiple times that BRR/Aerocoach and some other similar tests correlate well with real road performance, i.e., faster tyres in those tests are faster also in real world.

Verified by whom using what kind of methodology?

Sure, GP5ks are faster than Gatorskins both in real world and in BCRR tests. But if you were to follow BCRR, you'd think that Contis are faster tyre on the road, which is simply not the case. BCRR also suggests that high pressures are faster, which isn't necessarily true either.

You're asking for a source. So what's yours showing BRR does not correlate with real-world?

[CampagYOLO]

Pog and UAE were very keen to move from Pirelli to Continental tyres last year. So much so that they broke a 2 year deal to move after 1 year.

https://cyclinguptodate.com/cycling/vid ... an-descent

[BalticSea]

Well, BCRR tests do not really correlate with real world, so I'd trust bikeradar over them.

It has been verified multiple times that BRR/Aerocoach and some other similar tests correlate well with real road performance, i.e., faster tyres in those tests are faster also in real world.

Verified by whom using what kind of methodology?

Sure, GP5ks are faster than Gatorskins both in real world and in BCRR tests. But if you were to follow BCRR, you'd think that Contis are faster tyre on the road, which is simply not the case. BCRR also suggests that high pressures are faster, which isn't necessarily true either.

You do realize that the Silverstone Lab uses a smooth drum, right?

I trust BRR and Aerocoach over BikeRadar.

And yet the drum BRR uses is much smaller than the one Silverstone uses. Bigger drums simulate flat surface better than small drum

[TobinHatesYou]

Pog and UAE were very keen to move from Pirelli to Continental tyres last year. So much so that they broke a 2 year deal to move after 1 year.

https://cyclinguptodate.com/cycling/*f##k*

Plus the last two hour records were set on GP5K TT TRs.

[BalticSea]

Well, BCRR tests do not really correlate with real world, so I'd trust bikeradar over them.

It has been verified multiple times that BRR/Aerocoach and some other similar tests correlate well with real road performance, i.e., faster tyres in those tests are faster also in real world.

Verified by whom using what kind of methodology?

Sure, GP5ks are faster than Gatorskins both in real world and in BCRR tests. But if you were to follow BCRR, you'd think that Contis are faster tyre on the road, which is simply not the case. BCRR also suggests that high pressures are faster, which isn't necessarily true either.

You're asking for a source. So what's yours showing BRR does not correlate with real-world?

https://www.renehersecycles.com/tire-te ... real-road/

I don't know where you live, but where I live people ride on roads/bike paths that are mostly flat. Small drum/roller can't replicate flat surfaces, therefore those tests do not correlate with real world.

[mrlobber]

Are you a secret Pirelli influencer/employee as you keep pushing the Pirelli agenda both here (because the Bikeradar tests shows PIrellis as the fastest) and also in the Farsports thread? If you happened to be associated with a local Trek dealer in the Baltics, I might even take an educated quess what your real name is

Tell that to all the riders, including pro TT consultants, who run Corsa Speeds, GP5K TT as TT tyres, and so on, having tested their Crr, Cda and everything on track, and elsewhere. And now the Bikeradar test (which also is on the drum, as noted earlier) suddently invalidates all those results?

Pressure impact on rolling resistance given certain road conditions has been documented for several years already (included in many optimal tyre pressure calculators now), but it does not contradict the BRR, Aerocoach and other drum testing results on relative tyre rankings, which are the ones we care about here.
This has been debated ad nauseum, if you want technical discussion of many pages, search in Slowtwitch forum, there have been at least 2 if not more big topics on this there. Some which I could find quickly (contain a lot of useless stuff too, of course):
https://forum.slowtwitch.com/forum/Slow ... _P7792691/ (started from dubious Zipp marketing statements)
https://forum.slowtwitch.com/forum/Slow ... _P7714042/
https://forum.slowtwitch.com/forum/Slow ... 7775586-3/

[warthog101]

https://www.renehersecycles.com/tire-te ... real-road/

I don't know where you live, but where I live people ride on roads/bike paths that are mostly flat. Small drum/roller can't replicate flat surfaces, therefore those tests do not correlate with real world.

Ahh Jan Heine. Yep what he says makes a lot of sense. Pretty soon the pro peleton will come to their senses and listen to him too.

https://www.renehersecycles.com/why-wid ... ot-slower/

[otnemem]

Well, BCRR tests do not really correlate with real world, so I'd trust bikeradar over them.

It has been verified multiple times that BRR/Aerocoach and some other similar tests correlate well with real road performance, i.e., faster tyres in those tests are faster also in real world.

This.

I can't believe people puff their chest on rolling resistance and aero talking all kinds of crap and don't even bother keeping up with the marginal gains podcast where this has been beaten to death.

If a new methodology/testing comes out with different results from the ones already known to correlate to other tests and verified with the Chung method, I'd circle back to Carl Sagan's quote on extraordinary claims.

[BigBoyND]

It has been verified multiple times that BRR/Aerocoach and some other similar tests correlate well with real road performance, i.e., faster tyres in those tests are faster also in real world.

Verified by whom using what kind of methodology?

Sure, GP5ks are faster than Gatorskins both in real world and in BCRR tests. But if you were to follow BCRR, you'd think that Contis are faster tyre on the road, which is simply not the case. BCRR also suggests that high pressures are faster, which isn't necessarily true either.

You're asking for a source. So what's yours showing BRR does not correlate with real-world?

https://www.renehersecycles.com/tire-te ... real-road/

I don't know where you live, but where I live people ride on roads/bike paths that are mostly flat. Small drum/roller can't replicate flat surfaces, therefore those tests do not correlate with real world.

That article doesn't add anything new beside the knob section.

The section claiming that pressure doesn't affect RR just makes no sense. It completely contradicts the existence of hysteresis losses.

Most importantly though, the link makes no claim againts the general trend that if tire A is faster on the drum than B, it will also be faster on the road. The magnitudes will vary but the general order of tires won't change much.

[BalticSea]

Are you a secret Pirelli influencer/employee as you keep pushing the Pirelli agenda both here (because the Bikeradar tests shows PIrellis as the fastest) and also in the Farsports thread? If you happened to be associated with a local Trek dealer in the Baltics, I might even take an educated quess what your real name is

Tell that to all the riders, including pro TT consultants, who run Corsa Speeds, GP5K TT as TT tyres, and so on, having tested their Crr, Cda and everything on track, and elsewhere. And now the Bikeradar test (which also is on the drum, as noted earlier) suddently invalidates all those results?

Pressure impact on rolling resistance given certain road conditions has been documented for several years already (included in many optimal tyre pressure calculators now), but it does not contradict the BRR, Aerocoach and other drum testing results on relative tyre rankings, which are the ones we care about here.
This has been debated ad nauseum, if you want technical discussion of many pages, search in Slowtwitch forum, there have been at least 2 if not more big topics on this there. Some which I could find quickly (contain a lot of useless stuff too, of course):
https://forum.slowtwitch.com/forum/Slow ... _P7792691/ (started from dubious Zipp marketing statements)
https://forum.slowtwitch.com/forum/Slow ... _P7714042/
https://forum.slowtwitch.com/forum/Slow ... 7775586-3/

No, I do not have any affiliation with Pirelli. Also, get it right - I'm pushing anti-Conti agenda, not pro-Pirelli agenda

Jokes aside, people have been moving to lower pressures, wider tyres as of late. According to BCRR, all of this would result in worse tyre performance, but yet here we are.