Deeper rear wheel / staggered rim depth, aero gainz?
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The spirit of this board is to compile and organize wheels and tires related discussions.
If a new wheel tech is released, (say for example, TPU tubes, a brand new tire, or a new rim standard), feel free to start the discussion in the popular "Road". Your topic will eventually be moved here!
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The difference will be imperceptible going from 50/50 to 50/60 imo. 40/60 makes no sense to me. I would only ever ride 40s in a hilly road race.
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So little huh? Is there data on this you've seen or know of?TobinHatesYou wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 7:19 am
I mean okay sure if that's what you already have. Going from 40mm rear to 60mm rear might be good for ~1W at 45km/h.
I understand that the rear wheel is sheltered mostly under normal co dictions but I'm wondering if having the deeper rear wheel can give you some of the sailing effect under certain wind conditions you get from the deep wheelset.
I guess I'll file this one under potential marginal gains that nobody has explored in depth... I'm going to try asking swissside if they have sailing effect data based on f/r. I'd like to assume someone has given the ubiquity of rear disc TT and tri wheels.
SwissSide has some helpful comparative data for different staggered setups of their Hadron^2 wheels, which are the same as the new DT Swiss 1100 Dicut wheels.
https://www.swissside.com/collections/h ... #configure
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https://www.swissside.com/collections/h ... #configure
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Wow what an eye opener! I can't believe there's only c. 6w between a pair of 50mm wheels and 80mm f/disk r at 45km/h.Turrifik wrote: ↑Sat Mar 11, 2023 1:57 pmSwissSide has some helpful comparative data for different staggered setups of their Hadron^2 wheels, which are the same as the new DT Swiss 1100 Dicut wheels.
https://www.swissside.com/collections/h ... #configure
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Makes me think my 55mm Eastons are a sweet spot and no point ever upgrading to 80mms.
Giant Propel Advanced SL Red Etap 11s Easton EC90 wheels CeramicSpeed BB Zipp SL70 bars 6.5kg
Vitus ZX1 CRS Campy Chorus 12s Bora WTO 45 disk brake wheels Zipp SL70 bars 7.5kg
Vitus ZX1 CRS Campy Chorus 12s Bora WTO 45 disk brake wheels Zipp SL70 bars 7.5kg
SL8 build with Craft CS5060 Wheels in progress
Well that's something, thanks for postingTurrifik wrote: ↑Sat Mar 11, 2023 1:57 pmSwissSide has some helpful comparative data for different staggered setups of their Hadron^2 wheels, which are the same as the new DT Swiss 1100 Dicut wheels.
https://www.swissside.com/collections/h ... #configure
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I'm not so sure though because of the sail effect you can get at high yaw angles. Supposedly the disc wheel can provide 20-30w advantage in the right wind conditions, over an 80mm wheel:Nickldn wrote: ↑Sat Mar 11, 2023 2:30 pmWow what an eye opener! I can't believe there's only c. 6w between a pair of 50mm wheels and 80mm f/disk r at 45km/h.Turrifik wrote: ↑Sat Mar 11, 2023 1:57 pmSwissSide has some helpful comparative data for different staggered setups of their Hadron^2 wheels, which are the same as the new DT Swiss 1100 Dicut wheels.
https://www.swissside.com/collections/h ... #configure
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Makes me think my 55mm Eastons are a sweet spot and no point ever upgrading to 80mms.
https://forum.slowtwitch.com/forum/?pos ... 5#p7346345
I can't find much on the sailing effect of various normal wheel depths or front rear bias however. But I'm thinking the rear wheel sees less drag but also provides the same amount of sail as the front wheel.
Yep. Was a marginal gains eye opener for sure. Still didn’t stop me from ordering their 80/80 wheelsspartacus wrote:Well that's something, thanks for postingTurrifik wrote: ↑Sat Mar 11, 2023 1:57 pmSwissSide has some helpful comparative data for different staggered setups of their Hadron^2 wheels, which are the same as the new DT Swiss 1100 Dicut wheels.
https://www.swissside.com/collections/h ... #configure
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Here's the response from Swiss Side:
Thank you very much for your mail and kindly excuse my delayed reply.
With regards to your question, kindly note that the front wheel is by far the major generator of sailing effect because it sees the free-stream air speed and angle. So when there is a cross-wind, the front wheel generates the vast majority (>70% of the sailing effect). The rear wheel is less effective in terms of sailing effect for two reasons:
The airflow is slower and has less energy by the time it reaches the rear wheel,
The airflow angle is reduced (straightened) by the time it gets the rear wheel. Hence why aerodynamically the front wheel has more importance, particular in cross-winds.
I trust the above clarifies. By further questions, kindly let me know.
Wishing you a good day.
Thank you very much for your mail and kindly excuse my delayed reply.
With regards to your question, kindly note that the front wheel is by far the major generator of sailing effect because it sees the free-stream air speed and angle. So when there is a cross-wind, the front wheel generates the vast majority (>70% of the sailing effect). The rear wheel is less effective in terms of sailing effect for two reasons:
The airflow is slower and has less energy by the time it reaches the rear wheel,
The airflow angle is reduced (straightened) by the time it gets the rear wheel. Hence why aerodynamically the front wheel has more importance, particular in cross-winds.
I trust the above clarifies. By further questions, kindly let me know.
Wishing you a good day.
An aero-helmet would make more differencespartacus wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 2:36 pmSo little huh? Is there data on this you've seen or know of?TobinHatesYou wrote: ↑Fri Mar 10, 2023 7:19 am
I mean okay sure if that's what you already have. Going from 40mm rear to 60mm rear might be good for ~1W at 45km/h.
I understand that the rear wheel is sheltered mostly under normal co dictions but I'm wondering if having the deeper rear wheel can give you some of the sailing effect under certain wind conditions you get from the deep wheelset.
The difference between an aero road helmet and a standard road helmet is around 6 watts at 45 km/h (3 watts at 35 km/h).
https://www.swissside.com/blogs/aero-ti ... met-choice
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