TL tire popping into the rim bed, dangerous?

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FlatlandClimber
Posts: 2491
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2020 3:37 pm

by FlatlandClimber

Hey everyone,
I have a set of relatively narrow TT wheels (18.8mm internal, hooked) that I have set up tubelessly with TT tires.
When the air pressure gets super low, the tires pop off the bead, and into the rim bed.
I've tried three different tires (GP 5000s TR, GP5000 TT and Vittoria Corsa Speed), the standard single wrapping (factory installed tape), double wrapping and triple wrapping. Nothing seems to help.
The tire goes onto the rim relatively easily, but doesnt sit stupidly loose or can be removed easily by hand.
I've tried fitting a Vittoria tire liner in the smallest size, but even that was too big to get it fitted.

So, what can I do, and is this really dangerous? Riding on a fully deflated tire would be dangerous either way, so is this a thing I really need to fix?
If so, what do I need to do?
Thanks in advance.
Cervelo P5 Disc (2021) 9.1kg
Factor Ostro Gravel (2023) 8.0kg
S-Works SL8 (2023) 6.3kg

*weights are race ready, size 58/L.
Sold: Venge, S5 Disc, Roubaix Team, Open WI.DE, Émonda, Shiv TT, Crux, Aethos, SL7

by Weenie


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TobinHatesYou
Posts: 12457
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

The main problem is if the tire unseats in the middle of a ride, then a minipump will not be able to reseat it. You’d need to have CO2 or insert a tube.
Last edited by TobinHatesYou on Mon Dec 19, 2022 4:52 pm, edited 2 times in total.

FlatlandClimber
Posts: 2491
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2020 3:37 pm

by FlatlandClimber

That's a good point. That wouldn't be that much of an issue for me though.
Cervelo P5 Disc (2021) 9.1kg
Factor Ostro Gravel (2023) 8.0kg
S-Works SL8 (2023) 6.3kg

*weights are race ready, size 58/L.
Sold: Venge, S5 Disc, Roubaix Team, Open WI.DE, Émonda, Shiv TT, Crux, Aethos, SL7

User avatar
Miller
Posts: 2764
Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2006 8:54 pm
Location: Reading, UK

by Miller

I rode wheels like that for ages, in fact I have a pair of wheels where the tyres still do that, so I am in the 'annoying but not dangerous' camp. As noted, the issue is how to reseat the tyres mid-ride should that be necessary.

FlatlandClimber
Posts: 2491
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2020 3:37 pm

by FlatlandClimber

Cheers. I got the same reply from the manufacturer. These are mainly race day wheels anyway, so probably no harm in any of that.
Cervelo P5 Disc (2021) 9.1kg
Factor Ostro Gravel (2023) 8.0kg
S-Works SL8 (2023) 6.3kg

*weights are race ready, size 58/L.
Sold: Venge, S5 Disc, Roubaix Team, Open WI.DE, Émonda, Shiv TT, Crux, Aethos, SL7

Attermann
Posts: 916
Joined: Sun Jan 05, 2014 11:04 pm
Location: Denmark

by Attermann

give it a couple of layers of tape, that will make them sit harder against the hook, so they won't pop off.

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 12457
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

Attermann wrote:
Mon Dec 19, 2022 7:55 pm
give it a couple of layers of tape, that will make them sit harder against the hook, so they won't pop off.
According to the opening post, he's already tried 3 layers.

Attermann
Posts: 916
Joined: Sun Jan 05, 2014 11:04 pm
Location: Denmark

by Attermann

In that case I wouldn't call the rims tubeless compatible

FlatlandClimber
Posts: 2491
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2020 3:37 pm

by FlatlandClimber

Attermann wrote:
Tue Dec 20, 2022 9:11 am
In that case I wouldn't call the rims tubeless compatible
I don't know if "tubeless compatible" constitutes "the tire doesn't unseat when at low or no air pressure". I literally don't know... all the other aspects of TL compatibility work though.
Cervelo P5 Disc (2021) 9.1kg
Factor Ostro Gravel (2023) 8.0kg
S-Works SL8 (2023) 6.3kg

*weights are race ready, size 58/L.
Sold: Venge, S5 Disc, Roubaix Team, Open WI.DE, Émonda, Shiv TT, Crux, Aethos, SL7

Attermann
Posts: 916
Joined: Sun Jan 05, 2014 11:04 pm
Location: Denmark

by Attermann

In my regard I would say that it's when a tire stays on the rim even thou it has lost all pressure, I wouldn't ride anything that doesn't do that.

FlatlandClimber
Posts: 2491
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2020 3:37 pm

by FlatlandClimber

Basically the question of this thread is: "why wouldn't you?"
Cervelo P5 Disc (2021) 9.1kg
Factor Ostro Gravel (2023) 8.0kg
S-Works SL8 (2023) 6.3kg

*weights are race ready, size 58/L.
Sold: Venge, S5 Disc, Roubaix Team, Open WI.DE, Émonda, Shiv TT, Crux, Aethos, SL7

jlok
Posts: 2400
Joined: Tue Jun 30, 2015 3:30 am

by jlok

Attermann wrote:
Tue Dec 20, 2022 10:05 am
In my regard I would say that it's when a tire stays on the rim even thou it has lost all pressure, I wouldn't ride anything that doesn't do that.
+1
It's somehow indicates how easy the tubeless tire would burb. Scary stuff if you experienced it, which most likely would be followed by a crash.
Rikulau V9 DB Custom < BMC TM02 < Litespeed T1sl Disc < Giant Propel Advanced SL Disc 1 < Propel Adv < TCR Adv SL Disc < KTM Revelator Sky < CAAD 12 Disc < Domane S Disc < Alize < CAAD 10

CampagYOLO
Posts: 705
Joined: Thu May 06, 2021 3:58 pm

by CampagYOLO

As the tyres are going into the rim bed, that would suggest that there's no bead lock in your rims which is there to prevent this very thing happening.
As mentioned by others, this will increase the chance of the tyre burping and a blowout occuring if you had a puncture.

I may be being overly cautious but I'd run those wheels with tubes. I know that every watt matters when it comes to TT bikes but a latex tube set up isn't really any slower than a tubeless one.

TobinHatesYou
Posts: 12457
Joined: Mon Jul 24, 2017 12:02 pm

by TobinHatesYou

Pretty much every Roval road wheel before the Rapide/Alpinist generation were like this and they didn’t burp any more than other wheels…that I know of. Meanwhile I have seen certain tires release air/sealant even at 50psi just by squeezing the sidewalls with hand pressure.

by Weenie


Visit starbike.com Online Retailer for HighEnd cycling components
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warthog101
Posts: 872
Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2013 10:05 am

by warthog101

Hopefully the etrto standard will make these sort of issues less likely going forward. A uniform sizing system adopted as a standard should make tyres and wheels more compatible.

Loving road tubeless and sticking with it anyway. No desire to go back to tubes or worse still, singles.

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