Weight Weenies

heard from Michelin today that these tyres are NOT compatible with Zipp 404 FC (hookless IRW 23mm) at anything smaller than 30mm

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I run the non TLR version of the Power Cup in 28mm on my Zipp 303S hookless rims. No issues after about 1000km.

I've ran 25mm on my 303s with no issues at all. Pictures posted somewhere around this or under the 795 thread

k33z wrote:I run the non TLR version of the Power Cup in 28mm on my Zipp 303S hookless rims. No issues after about 1000km.

naavt wrote:I've ran 25mm on my 303s with no issues at all. Pictures posted somewhere around this or under the 795 thread

Those are anecdotical examples like people running TL on non TL rims, or people running their zip hookless at 6bars+ and “nothing happen”.

If the std changed there are reasons and it’s there to ensure that there are no risks in all reasonable circonstances. I wouldn’t be too surprise if the global tire companies like Michelin or Conti would stick to Etrto recommendations.

(Now the mess on nominal tire size labels remains and tire manufacturers are not really helping on that front).

C36 wrote: ↑

Fri May 12, 2023 9:38 pm

k33z wrote:I run the non TLR version of the Power Cup in 28mm on my Zipp 303S hookless rims. No issues after about 1000km.

naavt wrote:I've ran 25mm on my 303s with no issues at all. Pictures posted somewhere around this or under the 795 thread

Those are anecdotical examples like people running TL on non TL rims, or people running their zip hookless at 6bars+ and “nothing happen”.

If the std changed there are reasons and it’s there to ensure that there are no risks in all reasonable circonstances. I wouldn’t be too surprise if the global tire companies like Michelin or Conti would stick to Etrto recommendations.

(Now the mess on nominal tire size labels remains and tire manufacturers are not really helping on that front).

One of the upcoming Van Rysel bikes come with 404FC and Power Cups 28 as standard. Not sure what to think of it.

C36 wrote: ↑

Fri May 12, 2023 9:38 pm

Those are anecdotical examples like people running TL on non TL rims, or people running their zip hookless at 6bars+ and “nothing happen”.

If the std changed there are reasons and it’s there to ensure that there are no risks in all reasonable circonstances. I wouldn’t be too surprise if the global tire companies like Michelin or Conti would stick to Etrto recommendations.

(Now the mess on nominal tire size labels remains and tire manufacturers are not really helping on that front).

I understand the risks that companies like Michelin and Continental are exposed to when designing bits that can put lives at risk. Because of that, I also understand what "margin of error" means!

If I was to believe that kind of brand safety rules, I would never be riding my cranksets with my Campy groupsets which Campy says - literally in their manuals - "do not use! Risk of Death"

I'm using mixed cranksets with no compatible letter (as Campy states), on all my bikes (5), with zero issues to date!

But.. everyone knows about themselves and I clearly understand your fears.

You obviously are on your own right to go by the standards. My commment was not about that.

My comment was about riding 25mm Cups on a 303s, which I did successfully for many kms without ANY issues. And that's a fact!

Erlandal wrote:

C36 wrote: ↑

Fri May 12, 2023 9:38 pm

k33z wrote:I run the non TLR version of the Power Cup in 28mm on my Zipp 303S hookless rims. No issues after about 1000km.

naavt wrote:I've ran 25mm on my 303s with no issues at all. Pictures posted somewhere around this or under the 795 thread

Those are anecdotical examples like people running TL on non TL rims, or people running their zip hookless at 6bars+ and “nothing happen”.

If the std changed there are reasons and it’s there to ensure that there are no risks in all reasonable circonstances. I wouldn’t be too surprise if the global tire companies like Michelin or Conti would stick to Etrto recommendations.

(Now the mess on nominal tire size labels remains and tire manufacturers are not really helping on that front).

One of the upcoming Van Rysel bikes come with 404FC and Power Cups 28 as standard. Not sure what to think of it.

I am curious how Etrto communicates on changes cause for sure there are equipment development launched based on a std that changed by the time the product is released.
Similarly orders for OEM. I struggle to imagine large brands exposing themselves by not respecting the international std. few years ago I had been told that Amer companies (Mavic and enve) couldn’t develop things non Etrto std due to liability.

naavt wrote: If I was to believe that kind of brand safety rules, I would never be riding my cranksets with my Campy groupsets which Campy says - literally in their manuals - "do not use! Risk of Death"

There are 2 different things. Brand safety rules (that are in between a “cover my ass” and an arm twist to force new equipment purchase) and a global industry std.
If zipp said « those zipp tires are 100% fine with zipp wheels » they take full responsibility, they control both products.
Here we talk about products from multiple brands that should work together, then the need of an “external” std.

naavt wrote: You obviously are on your own right to go by the standards. My commment was not about that.

My comment was about riding 25mm Cups on a 303s, which I did successfully for many kms without ANY issues. And that's a fact!

A single data point doesn’t make it right or safe to be used as a std.

So what are we saying about these hoops then fellas? I really want to use them but am concerned about running on the sidewalls. I'm not a racer but I like to corner fast and always use the full tread of any tyres I've run. Currently it's between these or the new Pirellis with speedcore. Not sure the GP5000S TR offer enough puncture resistance for the lanes of Kent. Would appreciate some input. Looking to run them on some Roval Rapide CLX2s...

I love the Cups so far and wouldn't switch back to GP. Really supple rolling, no issues with sidewall, roll fast, and look great in tan.

With the reduction in puncture resistance, the GP is no longer the all around tire it used to be, imo.

Just got a pair of these (tan 25s) from tredz.co.uk for £84.58 delivered using code GETCYCLING for additional 10% off.

I was actually shopping for a pair of Corsa Pros, but these are a no brainer at half the price.

Edit: price increased on 16 May to £95.38

cheers guys. gonna give em a whirl

bobones wrote: ↑

Mon May 15, 2023 1:03 pm

Just got a pair of these (tan 25s) from tredz.co.uk for £84.58 delivered using code GETCYCLING for additional 10% off.

I was actually shopping for a pair of Corsa Pros, but these are a no brainer at half the price.

Edit: price increased on 16 May to £95.38

Thanks for the heads up - just ordered 28s (non TL) with classic tan sidewalls. Discount still on, and as I'm in the UK delivery is free so £71.98 for the pair. At that price they're worth a punt over the GP5000 which they'll replace.

Will be fitted to my Roval Rapide CLXs (21mm internal) so should hopefully sit nice and aero on the front wheel (35mm external) and flush on the rear wheel (30.7mm external).

BianchiDave wrote: ↑

Mon May 22, 2023 4:31 pm

Thanks for the heads up - just ordered 28s (non TL) with classic tan sidewalls. Discount still on, and as I'm in the UK delivery is free so £71.98 for the pair. At that price they're worth a punt over the GP5000 which they'll replace.

Will be fitted to my Roval Rapide CLXs (21mm internal) so should hopefully sit nice and aero on the front wheel (35mm external) and flush on the rear wheel (30.7mm external).

No problem. I did 86 miles on them on Saturday and they definitely seem to be more comfy than GP 5000 S TRs and just as fast. My 25s weighed 262g and 269g and measured 27.5 mm on 19 mm internal at 80 PSI.

My cream AS TRs have been darkened by Orange Seal so I'm hoping these keep their colour a bit longer.

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I use orange seal and have had no discoloration