33g Inner Tube - Ridenow TPU

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Mr.Gib
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by Mr.Gib

EtoDemerzel wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2024 8:43 pm
Really wish I liked tpu tubes but the ride quality...are there any differences between brands or all tpu's the same in this regard? I only use tpu as a spare for pack size now.

Compared to latex, tpu feel sketch especially cornering at speed. Can't deny the weight savings though.
Something is not right here. Even the heavier weight TPU inner tubes are not rigid enough to interfer with the suppleness of any tire to the point of affecting grip. The lighter versions almost resemble a plastic sandwich bag in your hands after they have been used - they are that pliable. If rolling resistance is any measure, and I believe it is, TPU performance in terms of being able to conform to road surface imperfections, is nearly the equal of latex and superior to butyl.
wheelsONfire wrote: When we ride disc brakes the whole deal of braking is just like a leaving a fart. It happens and then it's over. Nothing planned and nothing to get nervous for.

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EtoDemerzel
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Joined: Sun Dec 17, 2023 4:13 pm

by EtoDemerzel

Mr.Gib wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2024 11:23 pm
EtoDemerzel wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2024 8:43 pm
Really wish I liked tpu tubes but the ride quality...are there any differences between brands or all tpu's the same in this regard? I only use tpu as a spare for pack size now.

Compared to latex, tpu feel sketch especially cornering at speed. Can't deny the weight savings though.
Something is not right here. Even the heavier weight TPU inner tubes are not rigid enough to interfer with the suppleness of any tire to the point of affecting grip. The lighter versions almost resemble a plastic sandwich bag in your hands after they have been used - they are that pliable. If rolling resistance is any measure, and I believe it is, TPU performance in terms of being able to conform to road surface imperfections, is nearly the equal of latex and superior to butyl.
I don't know if it affects grip, but it certainly has a negative effect on feel. Maybe it's less noticable with tubeless tires, but I was running Corsas and GP5K's (non-tubeless) and latex just feels much better.
I really notice it on that transition railing turns at speed.
A few people have said the same.

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wheelbuilder
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by wheelbuilder

EtoDemerzel wrote:
Mr.Gib wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2024 11:23 pm
EtoDemerzel wrote:
Tue Jan 09, 2024 8:43 pm
Really wish I liked tpu tubes but the ride quality...are there any differences between brands or all tpu's the same in this regard? I only use tpu as a spare for pack size now.

Compared to latex, tpu feel sketch especially cornering at speed. Can't deny the weight savings though.
Something is not right here. Even the heavier weight TPU inner tubes are not rigid enough to interfer with the suppleness of any tire to the point of affecting grip. The lighter versions almost resemble a plastic sandwich bag in your hands after they have been used - they are that pliable. If rolling resistance is any measure, and I believe it is, TPU performance in terms of being able to conform to road surface imperfections, is nearly the equal of latex and superior to butyl.
I don't know if it affects grip, but it certainly has a negative effect on feel. Maybe it's less noticable with tubeless tires, but I was running Corsas and GP5K's (non-tubeless) and latex just feels much better.
I really notice it on that transition railing turns at speed.
A few people have said the same.
You are not imagining things. The folks that claim no easily discernable ride feel difference between latex and tpu are either very insensitive, don't want to admit it, or trolling..
Never cheer before you know who is winning

openwheelracing
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by openwheelracing

TPU tubes hurt my hands. Going back to latex the difference was immediate night and day.

EtoDemerzel
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Joined: Sun Dec 17, 2023 4:13 pm

by EtoDemerzel

Interesting feedback.
Best I can describe the feel:
Latex- smooth, predictable and like riding great tubs.
TPU- feels like the tpu slips inside the tire rather than being "at one" with the tire like latex.
tossing the bike over S-bends, it's disconcerting and I didn't get on with the ride feel.

But, I guess if tpu stuck to the tire like latex, it would rip. Latex just conforms to everything like a second skin.

Still that weight savings :lol: makes me want to not give up on them.
however, TPU are gamechangers for tight packing a spare tube so there's that 8)

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wheelbuilder
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by wheelbuilder

EtoDemerzel wrote:Interesting feedback.
Best I can describe the feel:
Latex- smooth, predictable and like riding great tubs.
TPU- feels like the tpu slips inside the tire rather than being "at one" with the tire like latex.
tossing the bike over S-bends, it's disconcerting and I didn't get on with the ride feel.

But, I guess if tpu stuck to the tire like latex, it would rip. Latex just conforms to everything like a second skin.

Still that weight savings Image makes me want to not give up on them.
however, TPU are gamechangers for tight packing a spare tube so there's that 8)
Great description. I carry them as spares also. They are great for that and have never let me down. You describe the cornering sensation very well. Latex is unmatched for clincher road feel and behavior.
Never cheer before you know who is winning

AsphaltAddict
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Joined: Fri Nov 17, 2023 6:57 pm

by AsphaltAddict

Would you prefer TPU tubes over Latex for grimy, wet winter rides?

Plan to run them with Conti GP 5000 4-Seasons.
Roads here are very potholy and flinty, so I am looking for the more puncture proof solution primarily – but don't wanna miss out too much on comfort and ride feel, either.

EtoDemerzel
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by EtoDemerzel

AsphaltAddict wrote:
Wed Jan 10, 2024 6:46 pm
Would you prefer TPU tubes over Latex for grimy, wet winter rides?

Plan to run them with Conti GP 5000 4-Seasons.
Roads here are very potholy and flinty, so I am looking for the more puncture proof solution primarily – but don't wanna miss out too much on comfort and ride feel, either.
JMO
Latex are more puncture resistant. They will flex much more before puncturing.
But latex looses air very quickly- you have to pump nearly every ride or every ride.

Butyl can be very puncture proof, but cheap, thick butyl rides like a garden hose.

TPU is seriously lightweight and packs very small.

Everything is a compromise but I don't see anything better than latex for ride feel with innertubes.

I value handling and quality ride so, nice tires/latex tubes are my priority there.
JRA bikes, cargo bike, etc - garden hoses with russian mil-spec tires- because no flats and not pumping tires are a priority here.
*I live in So Cal so winter rides are cold summer rides :D

AsphaltAddict
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Joined: Fri Nov 17, 2023 6:57 pm

by AsphaltAddict

EtoDemerzel wrote:
Wed Jan 10, 2024 11:34 pm
JMO
Latex are more puncture resistant. They will flex much more before puncturing.
But latex looses air very quickly- you have to pump nearly every ride or every ride.

Butyl can be very puncture proof, but cheap, thick butyl rides like a garden hose.

TPU is seriously lightweight and packs very small.

Everything is a compromise but I don't see anything better than latex for ride feel with innertubes.

I value handling and quality ride so, nice tires/latex tubes are my priority there.
JRA bikes, cargo bike, etc - garden hoses with russian mil-spec tires- because no flats and not pumping tires are a priority here.
*I live in So Cal so winter rides are cold summer rides :D
Thanks, then I will try out latex inner tubes and use TPU tubes as spares.
Ride quality is like a garden hose with the Conti 4 Season anyway, so I'll gladly take every bit of improved ride quality I can get with the latex tubes.
And pumping before each ride is part of my prep ritual, so not a big deal for me.

Also, man, you're so lucky living in California! Here in Berlin it's like -10 degrees Celsius freezing right now

EtoDemerzel
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by EtoDemerzel

Brutal!
But I love Berlin!

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Mr.Gib
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by Mr.Gib

EtoDemerzel wrote:
Wed Jan 10, 2024 6:09 pm
Interesting feedback.
Best I can describe the feel:
Latex- smooth, predictable and like riding great tubs.
TPU- feels like the tpu slips inside the tire rather than being "at one" with the tire like latex.
tossing the bike over S-bends, it's disconcerting and I didn't get on with the ride feel.

But, I guess if tpu stuck to the tire like latex, it would rip. Latex just conforms to everything like a second skin.
Something still doesn't sound right. How can an inflated innertube of any material move around inside a tire, or not move with the tire, when it is captured inside that tire at 60+ psi. The ride feel is inferior to latex, but that is as you would expect being less elastic. But I am having difficulty imagining the physics argument that would explain a significant decrease in cornering grip. For that to happen the innertube would have to be so rigid that it would interfer with the tires ability to stay in contact with the road surface. But even the most supple tires are many magnitudes more rigid than any inner tube. Do you notice the decreased grip with butyl as well?
wheelsONfire wrote: When we ride disc brakes the whole deal of braking is just like a leaving a fart. It happens and then it's over. Nothing planned and nothing to get nervous for.

EtoDemerzel
Posts: 356
Joined: Sun Dec 17, 2023 4:13 pm

by EtoDemerzel

Mr.Gib wrote:
Thu Jan 11, 2024 12:19 am
EtoDemerzel wrote:
Wed Jan 10, 2024 6:09 pm
Interesting feedback.
Best I can describe the feel:
Latex- smooth, predictable and like riding great tubs.
TPU- feels like the tpu slips inside the tire rather than being "at one" with the tire like latex.
tossing the bike over S-bends, it's disconcerting and I didn't get on with the ride feel.

But, I guess if tpu stuck to the tire like latex, it would rip. Latex just conforms to everything like a second skin.
Something still doesn't sound right. How can an inflated innertube of any material move around inside a tire, or not move with the tire, when it is captured inside that tire at 60+ psi. The ride feel is inferior to latex, but that is as you would expect being less elastic. But I am having difficulty imagining the physics argument that would explain a significant decrease in cornering grip. For that to happen the innertube would have to be so rigid that it would interfer with the tires ability to stay in contact with the road surface. But even the most supple tires are many magnitudes more rigid than any inner tube. Do you notice the decreased grip with butyl as well?
Respectfully, I have answered you a few posts earlier but I will repeat it, I don't know if it affects grip, but it certainly has a negative effect on feel.
I'm simply describing how latex and tpu feels to ride.

On to your doubt that a tube moves inside a tire casing:
One of the advantages of tubeless is lack of friction loss from tube-tire interaction.
Friction between tube and tire casing, and hysterisis from absorbing vibrations, relative to the tire casing and inner tube is a factor in rolling resistance.
But this is not me, this is across the board in established study by all tire makers and testing protocols.

On to your question on if this affects actual grip:
I don't know.

MagicShite
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Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2016 3:33 pm

by MagicShite

My close riding buddy of mine had the same conclusion after swapping to TPUs for every day ride for only a single ride. TPUs are simply too harsh at the same pressure.

Both of us immediately went back home after the ride and swap back to our latex.

I'm sure someday someone will have the time to measure the vibrations incurred on the TPUs versus Latex.

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JayDee81
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by JayDee81

Some TPU manufacturer said you should pump tires with his TPUs 3 psi less than you would with butyl tubes. Not sure what is the comparison with latex or tubeless.

by Weenie


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Mr.Gib
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by Mr.Gib

EtoDemerzel wrote:
Thu Jan 11, 2024 2:18 am
Mr.Gib wrote:
Thu Jan 11, 2024 12:19 am
EtoDemerzel wrote:
Wed Jan 10, 2024 6:09 pm
Interesting feedback.
Best I can describe the feel:
Latex- smooth, predictable and like riding great tubs.
TPU- feels like the tpu slips inside the tire rather than being "at one" with the tire like latex.
tossing the bike over S-bends, it's disconcerting and I didn't get on with the ride feel.

But, I guess if tpu stuck to the tire like latex, it would rip. Latex just conforms to everything like a second skin.
Something still doesn't sound right. How can an inflated innertube of any material move around inside a tire, or not move with the tire, when it is captured inside that tire at 60+ psi. The ride feel is inferior to latex, but that is as you would expect being less elastic. But I am having difficulty imagining the physics argument that would explain a significant decrease in cornering grip. For that to happen the innertube would have to be so rigid that it would interfer with the tires ability to stay in contact with the road surface. But even the most supple tires are many magnitudes more rigid than any inner tube. Do you notice the decreased grip with butyl as well?
Respectfully, I have answered you a few posts earlier but I will repeat it, I don't know if it affects grip, but it certainly has a negative effect on feel.
I'm simply describing how latex and tpu feels to ride.

On to your doubt that a tube moves inside a tire casing:
One of the advantages of tubeless is lack of friction loss from tube-tire interaction.
Friction between tube and tire casing, and hysterisis from absorbing vibrations, relative to the tire casing and inner tube is a factor in rolling resistance.
But this is not me, this is across the board in established study by all tire makers and testing protocols.

On to your question on if this affects actual grip:
I don't know.
Ah, OK, I took your statements "tossing the bike over S-bends, it's disconcerting" and "Compared to latex, tpu feel sketch especially cornering at speed." to mean a problem with grip.

Maybe I need to go back to latex to see if I notice a greater difference then when I moved from latex to TPU. A worthwhile experiment.
wheelsONfire wrote: When we ride disc brakes the whole deal of braking is just like a leaving a fart. It happens and then it's over. Nothing planned and nothing to get nervous for.

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