Bora WTO

Wheels, Tires, Tubes, Tubeless, Tubs, Spokes, Hookless, Hubs, and more!

Moderator: robbosmans

Forum rules
The spirit of this board is to compile and organize wheels and tires related discussions.

If a new wheel tech is released, (say for example, TPU tubes, a brand new tire, or a new rim standard), feel free to start the discussion in the popular "Road". Your topic will eventually be moved here!
Nickldn
Posts: 2008
Joined: Mon Mar 25, 2019 12:35 am

by Nickldn

Not a direct answer to your question, but I have owned WTO 45's with 25mm tyres for many years and my weight is about 10% higher than yours. I have found these wheels to be very stable in crosswinds compared to some shallower wheels. But of course they are not able to perform miracles and the best advice is probably not to descend at 60kph in high crosswinds. I really doubt you'll find other wheels to be much more stable in these conditions.

On the other hand 28mm tyres are great, so much more grip and security descending, it's well worth going wider.

dannyperish
Posts: 13
Joined: Sat May 13, 2017 12:22 pm

by dannyperish

Nickldn wrote:
Mon May 27, 2024 11:31 pm
Not a direct answer to your question, but I have owned WTO 45's with 25mm tyres for many years and my weight is about 10% higher than yours. I have found these wheels to be very stable in crosswinds compared to some shallower wheels. But of course they are not able to perform miracles and the best advice is probably not to descend at 60kph in high crosswinds. I really doubt you'll find other wheels to be much more stable in these conditions.

On the other hand 28mm tyres are great, so much more grip and security descending, it's well worth going wider.
thx for answer, I think you're right
it's hard to expect stability on with 45 with these inputs

for upgrade its more about better optimization for 28mm and 100g weight difference

by Weenie


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Nickldn
Posts: 2008
Joined: Mon Mar 25, 2019 12:35 am

by Nickldn

dannyperish wrote:
Tue May 28, 2024 8:36 am
Nickldn wrote:
Mon May 27, 2024 11:31 pm
Not a direct answer to your question, but I have owned WTO 45's with 25mm tyres for many years and my weight is about 10% higher than yours. I have found these wheels to be very stable in crosswinds compared to some shallower wheels. But of course they are not able to perform miracles and the best advice is probably not to descend at 60kph in high crosswinds. I really doubt you'll find other wheels to be much more stable in these conditions.

On the other hand 28mm tyres are great, so much more grip and security descending, it's well worth going wider.
thx for answer, I think you're right
it's hard to expect stability on with 45 with these inputs

for upgrade its more about better optimization for 28mm and 100g weight difference
I have been through the same thing recently and ended up with new CRW 5060 rims with carbon spokes to go with 28mm tyres and improved aero.

After a few hundred miles on the new setup I am really pleased with the wider tyres and consider the rims to be a second order change.

We all get caught up with new kit but sometimes lose sight of what's really gonna make the big difference. For me it's 100% the wider tyres. It's entirely possible for you to try 28mm tyres on the current WTOs, I expect it will make a much bigger difference than the 100g savings and slightly wider IW the new WTOs offer.

So save your money on the new wheels for now and try the 28mm tyres. It'll cost you less, give you time on the wider tyres and then you can consider your next purchase carefully.
Giant Propel Advanced SL Red Etap 11s Easton EC90 wheels CeramicSpeed BB Zipp SL70 bars 6.5kg

S-Works SL8 Dune White SRAM Red AXS Craft CS5060 wheels Roval Rapide bars 6.6kg

dannyperish
Posts: 13
Joined: Sat May 13, 2017 12:22 pm

by dannyperish

Nickldn wrote:
Tue May 28, 2024 11:47 am


I have been through the same thing recently and ended up with new CRW 5060 rims with carbon spokes to go with 28mm tyres and improved aero.

After a few hundred miles on the new setup I am really pleased with the wider tyres and consider the rims to be a second order change.

We all get caught up with new kit but sometimes lose sight of what's really gonna make the big difference. For me it's 100% the wider tyres. It's entirely possible for you to try 28mm tyres on the current WTOs, I expect it will make a much bigger difference than the 100g savings and slightly wider IW the new WTOs offer.

So save your money on the new wheels for now and try the 28mm tyres. It'll cost you less, give you time on the wider tyres and then you can consider your next purchase carefully.
yes, agree, I will try 28mm first

on the descents and cornering its became really critical, and weight for sure not first thing nowadays

bipagutschein
Posts: 4
Joined: Thu May 30, 2024 10:18 am

by bipagutschein

I'm in the market for a new wheelset and could use some advice. I'm torn between the Campagnolo Bora Ultra 35 and the Campagnolo Hyperon Ultra.
I plan to run 28mm tires, which makes me think that bora could be better, considering the rim width. However, I found hyperons for a couple hundred euro less than boras. are there really any major differences between these two? thanks.

Ol3Tarmac
Posts: 39
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2023 10:08 pm

by Ol3Tarmac

bipagutschein wrote:
Fri May 31, 2024 7:17 am
I'm in the market for a new wheelset and could use some advice. I'm torn between the Campagnolo Bora Ultra 35 and the Campagnolo Hyperon Ultra.
I plan to run 28mm tires, which makes me think that bora could be better, considering the rim width. However, I found hyperons for a couple hundred euro less than boras. are there really any major differences between these two? thanks.
I made similar considerations about the two product lines.

In the end i opted for the rim width and went with the Bora Ultra 45 instead of the 35 version.

Somewhere in this thread there is a statement that the Bora 35 are probably a quite redundand option. I also found the bora hub design to be more elevated and the hyperons are not a recent product. Considering that the Hyperons are still comparable priced.

However, if you are looking first and foremost for a climbing wheelset the Hyperons might be still the better option.

Ol3Tarmac
Posts: 39
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2023 10:08 pm

by Ol3Tarmac

May I ask for your opinions regarding running the Bora wheelset tubeless.

Currently I use tpu tubes on the wheels but I wonder, whether if this might be are waste of potential.

I've learned that tubeless is not always the lightest setup. With 30mm tires the pressure is not a topic. Whereas the regular need to inflate the tires of tubeless wheels anoyes me.

So is there is waste of potential but not using a tubeless setup on the Bora wheelset in terms of rolling resistance, puncture protection as well as other factors if you using innertubes?
Attachments
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jazgill
Posts: 10
Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2014 3:06 pm

by jazgill

Ol3Tarmac wrote:
Tue Jun 04, 2024 7:50 am
bipagutschein wrote:
Fri May 31, 2024 7:17 am
I'm in the market for a new wheelset and could use some advice. I'm torn between the Campagnolo Bora Ultra 35 and the Campagnolo Hyperon Ultra.
I plan to run 28mm tires, which makes me think that bora could be better, considering the rim width. However, I found hyperons for a couple hundred euro less than boras. are there really any major differences between these two? thanks.
I made similar considerations about the two product lines.

In the end i opted for the rim width and went with the Bora Ultra 45 instead of the 35 version.

Somewhere in this thread there is a statement that the Bora 35 are probably a quite redundand option. I also found the bora hub design to be more elevated and the hyperons are not a recent product. Considering that the Hyperons are still comparable priced.

However, if you are looking first and foremost for a climbing wheelset the Hyperons might be still the better option.
The new Hyperons are a recent product; released last year.

simbikotic
Posts: 157
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2020 12:52 am

by simbikotic

Ol3Tarmac wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2024 11:47 am
May I ask for your opinions regarding running the Bora wheelset tubeless.

Currently I use tpu tubes on the wheels but I wonder, whether if this might be are waste of potential.

I've learned that tubeless is not always the lightest setup. With 30mm tires the pressure is not a topic. Whereas the regular need to inflate the tires of tubeless wheels anoyes me.

So is there is waste of potential but not using a tubeless setup on the Bora wheelset in terms of rolling resistance, puncture protection as well as other factors if you using innertubes?
I can share my personal experience. I have been running BORA WTO 45 with Pirelli PZero TLR (26mm 80psi) for 6,000km. The experience has been really flawless. I can seat them with a track pump. I have had 0 ride stopping punctures. I have spotted the latex on the seatube signs that I have had a puncture. I have also found nails inside the tyres when changing them. But I have never lost significant pressure on a ride. Also, I have not noticed that they lose pressure much in the garage. My tires with TPU tubes deflate more quickly to be honest.

I have read a lot of stuff about people having problems with road tubeless, so I recognize that my experience is not universal. I assume that some rim+tire combinations work better than others. In my experience BORA+Pirelli are awesome.

Swatch
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Jun 09, 2024 3:58 pm

by Swatch

ParisCarbon wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 1:50 pm
For anyone wondering, the WTO uses the sme CULT bering kit as the Bora Ultra wheels... if you can locate the cups/cones seperately you can save yourself a little bit of money as the bearing are the same as the USB.. I just ended up getting the entire kits for F/R and now I have some spare bearings.. WTO 60 dark labels should be here Friday.. they are getting the CULT treatment and Spec Cotton Turbos 26s with Latex tubes..should be quick!!
Hello @ParisCarbon
I know it's an old publication, but I do have WTO 45 (rim brake) and was planning to update the USB bearings/cup/cones to CULT like you did.

1) First question, what is the weight saved in grams per wheel by replacing the USB bearing with CULT?

2) Edit : ok, I found that I need HB-HY100 for the rear and HB-BO100 for the front, thank you!

3) I don't know if you are still using those wheels, but after 4-5 years, do you still think that this upgrade really worth it?

Thank you very much!
Last edited by Swatch on Wed Jun 12, 2024 3:21 pm, edited 4 times in total.

usr
Posts: 1020
Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2021 5:58 pm

by usr

Swatch wrote:
Mon Jun 10, 2024 12:57 pm
1) First question, what is the weight saved in grams per wheel by replacing the USB bearing with CULT?
I would not expect any weight saving, because the ceramic balls are the same and the races are one type of steel being replaced by another type of steel (a much better type, presumably). The closest thing to a weight difference difference would be lubrication and sealing.

ParisCarbon
Posts: 1946
Joined: Mon Feb 05, 2007 5:39 am
Location: Winnipeg Canada

by ParisCarbon

Swatch wrote:
Mon Jun 10, 2024 12:57 pm
ParisCarbon wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 1:50 pm
For anyone wondering, the WTO uses the sme CULT bering kit as the Bora Ultra wheels... if you can locate the cups/cones seperately you can save yourself a little bit of money as the bearing are the same as the USB.. I just ended up getting the entire kits for F/R and now I have some spare bearings.. WTO 60 dark labels should be here Friday.. they are getting the CULT treatment and Spec Cotton Turbos 26s with Latex tubes..should be quick!!
Hello @ParisCarbon
I know it's an old publication, but I do have WTO 45 (rim brake) and was planning to update the USB bearings/cup/cones to CULT like you did.

1) First question, what is the weight saved in grams per wheel by replacing the USB bearing with CULT?

2) Edit : ok, I found that I need HB-HY100 for the rear and HB-BO100 for the front, thank you!

3) I don't know if you are still using those wheels, but after 4-5 years, do you still think that this upgrade really worth it?

Thank you very much!
Yes I still have the wheels, and they still roll like crazy.. to answert your questions...
1) Don't expect any weight savings.. and just to verify you understand the mod.. the bearing that is in the current wheel is a ceramic bearing.. its the cups and cones that are the CULT portion.. they are hardened from my understanding.. instead of using grease, you use very light oil for lubrication (I use Prolink Gold)

2) I see you found the parts

3) There definately was a noticeable difference in how long the wheel spins.. if you are investing in the proper tools and kits to do one set of wheels.. I dunno if its totally worth it...I did multiple sets of wheels, so the purchasing of the tools etc is worth it to me...

Swatch
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Jun 09, 2024 3:58 pm

by Swatch

ParisCarbon wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2024 5:17 pm
Swatch wrote:
Mon Jun 10, 2024 12:57 pm
ParisCarbon wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 1:50 pm
For anyone wondering, the WTO uses the sme CULT bering kit as the Bora Ultra wheels... if you can locate the cups/cones seperately you can save yourself a little bit of money as the bearing are the same as the USB.. I just ended up getting the entire kits for F/R and now I have some spare bearings.. WTO 60 dark labels should be here Friday.. they are getting the CULT treatment and Spec Cotton Turbos 26s with Latex tubes..should be quick!!
Hello @ParisCarbon
I know it's an old publication, but I do have WTO 45 (rim brake) and was planning to update the USB bearings/cup/cones to CULT like you did.

1) First question, what is the weight saved in grams per wheel by replacing the USB bearing with CULT?

2) Edit : ok, I found that I need HB-HY100 for the rear and HB-BO100 for the front, thank you!

3) I don't know if you are still using those wheels, but after 4-5 years, do you still think that this upgrade really worth it?

Thank you very much!
Yes I still have the wheels, and they still roll like crazy.. to answert your questions...
1) Don't expect any weight savings.. and just to verify you understand the mod.. the bearing that is in the current wheel is a ceramic bearing.. its the cups and cones that are the CULT portion.. they are hardened from my understanding.. instead of using grease, you use very light oil for lubrication (I use Prolink Gold)

2) I see you found the parts

3) There definately was a noticeable difference in how long the wheel spins.. if you are investing in the proper tools and kits to do one set of wheels.. I dunno if its totally worth it...I did multiple sets of wheels, so the purchasing of the tools etc is worth it to me...
Thank you @ParisCarbon! My Campagnolo bike shop can to the mod for a good price, but the parts are quite expensive. On the other hand, it's almost like having a WTO Ultra! I'll need to find an "Ultra" sticker to put on the wheel to increase the value ;)

Hensem
Posts: 46
Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2024 4:36 pm

by Hensem

Probably my question may seem strange, it’s like going to the Mercedes forum and asking why I should buy it and not a Kia. However, why do you think that Bora WTO Ultra is better than, for example, Farsport with carbon spokes and weighing 150g less? I have money for both and I'm trying to figure out what to do. The appearance of Campa is certainly fantastic. At the moment I am looking towards the 35mm c23 as a golden mean between climbing and traveling in a group with friends. 45mm seems heavier to me, although I like it better in appearance.

commendatore
Posts: 277
Joined: Mon Dec 30, 2013 1:51 am
Location: North Carolina

by commendatore

I'm having this same debate with myself between the hunt limitless and the new WTO 60 :shock:

by Weenie


Visit starbike.com Online Retailer for HighEnd cycling components
Great Prices ✓    Broad Selection ✓    Worldwide Delivery ✓

www.starbike.com



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