2022 new xc frames?

Discuss light weight issues concerning mountain bikes & parts.

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js
Posts: 1017
Joined: Tue Nov 18, 2008 9:57 pm
Location: Canada

by js

Maybe I'm missing something here, but I don't really see how BSA vs BB92 contributes to better tire clearance on a full suspension bike.

BB86 on the road - for sure that contributes, as the chainstays are connected to the BB, which is wider thanks to the inset bearings, so there are big gains to be had on a road frame or hardtail.

But the width of the BB on a full suspension bike doesn't seem to have any limitations on the width of the chainstays. The chainstays are connected to the pivot and again, the pivot at least on the bikes mentioned above, has no reason to be limited by the BB dimensions either.

Having said all that, I'm currently riding an Epic Evo and have had more noise from two years on it than I had from seven years on Giant XTC and Anthems, so I definitely support the recognition that just because anyone had issues with press-fit on one bike, that doesn't mean all press-fit is bad - or that all threaded BSA is good.

Hexsense
Posts: 3344
Joined: Wed Dec 30, 2015 12:41 am
Location: USA

by Hexsense

js wrote:
Wed Aug 09, 2023 8:44 pm
Maybe I'm missing something here, but I don't really see how BSA vs BB92 contributes to better tire clearance on a full suspension bike.

BB86 on the road - for sure that contributes, as the chainstays are connected to the BB, which is wider thanks to the inset bearings, so there are big gains to be had on a road frame or hardtail.
Yeah, you are right. The chainstay of FS doesn't really run from bb to the wheel. So it doesn't really matter. If anything, seat tube width where the pivot connect would affact it more.

by Weenie


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req110
Posts: 901
Joined: Thu Nov 22, 2018 10:23 am

by req110

Those people are either spoiled or lying. I had Spark RC 2022+ and also this Epic 2022+ and consider rear lateral stiffness absolutely ok. The only issue is with BRAIN.

That moves us to the next topic - shock absorbers.

I had to replace rear brain twice within 4000km. It holds only like 2000km and then it does not hold locked and clunks in the shock absorber.
I prefer that my next bike will have conventional shock absorbers.
SW SL8 RTP 56cm @ SH 9270 / Roval Rapide CLX II / CS OSPW / CEMA BB
S Epic 8 L @ XX T-Type / Berg Ratheberg 30 / Quarq / Fox Transfer SL 100mm / 3p

zscs
Posts: 142
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2018 12:05 pm
Location: Hungary

by zscs

Some very good points you guys emphasized regarding Bottom Bracket choice. I would also prefer BSA over Pressfit, even if I've had good experience with Pressfit BBs.

I would add two other - let's say - trends which can raise some questions (at least to me):
1) cable routing through headset
2) Flatmount brake caliper at the rear...

I have a MY2023 Lux CFR WC which has flatmount brake caliper and this thing drives me crazy... I have to always adjust it every 2nd ride, just terrible. And this is apparently a kind of trend. Okay, maybe manufacturers who create fullys can benefit from it, if they go for the flex stays but anyway...
And I still can't understand why manufacturers using flatmount on hardtail MTBs (a new example from Merida: https://www.bikeradar.com/features/bike ... -nine-10k/ , Orbea Alma OMX is similar, Exceed CFR, etc.).

req110
Posts: 901
Joined: Thu Nov 22, 2018 10:23 am

by req110

1) Cable routing through headset - looks really cool, especially combined with those new sram level brakes, or maybe picolla brakes, where cable can be really close to handlebars.

Some say that it increases complexity for headset bearing removal. Truth is that i ride in all conditions and never had to replace headset, nor clean the headset. Maybe i am using too good grease when building a bike.

2) Flat mount calipers - especially combination of postmount of front and flatmount on rear is something nobody asked for. I don't see much point why it that and i would be ok with post mount on both sides.
SW SL8 RTP 56cm @ SH 9270 / Roval Rapide CLX II / CS OSPW / CEMA BB
S Epic 8 L @ XX T-Type / Berg Ratheberg 30 / Quarq / Fox Transfer SL 100mm / 3p

smartyiak
Posts: 354
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2011 5:20 pm

by smartyiak

It's just a marketing video....but you get to look at a pretty bike (new Supercal):
https://youtu.be/66K78_72xSY

req110
Posts: 901
Joined: Thu Nov 22, 2018 10:23 am

by req110

I kind of like it.
They also say the shock is "easy to service". I am interested how, and how proprietary this design is.

What I am trying to avoid is the same I am experiencing with the Brain.

1) I need almost ANY bike shop to service it, not just one specialized shop in the Netherlands. I want as short riding outage as possible.
2) As long life as possible, I need this to be built of non-proprietary parts, so bike can exist couple more years before scrapping.
SW SL8 RTP 56cm @ SH 9270 / Roval Rapide CLX II / CS OSPW / CEMA BB
S Epic 8 L @ XX T-Type / Berg Ratheberg 30 / Quarq / Fox Transfer SL 100mm / 3p

User avatar
Snabb
Posts: 103
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 1:43 am
Location: Sweden

by Snabb

thepassista wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2023 3:23 pm
a german webshop rushed the things a bit :D

Supercaliber gen2 9.7 SL https://www.die-edelhelfer.de/trek-supe ... ower-surge
Supercaliber gen2 9.8 SLR https://www.die-edelhelfer.de/trek-supe ... -red-smoke
The supercaliber frame weight isn´t that light compared to other frames that has 100-120 mm. So with a good lock-out what is the benefit of the supercaliber and Epic WC bikes ? I like the design but not sure if I should change my Epic yet.
Ride lots!

aeroskii
Posts: 36
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2023 9:13 pm

by aeroskii

Snabb wrote:
Tue Aug 15, 2023 8:53 am
thepassista wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2023 3:23 pm
a german webshop rushed the things a bit :D

Supercaliber gen2 9.7 SL https://www.die-edelhelfer.de/trek-supe ... ower-surge
Supercaliber gen2 9.8 SLR https://www.die-edelhelfer.de/trek-supe ... -red-smoke
The supercaliber frame weight isn´t that light compared to other frames that has 100-120 mm. So with a good lock-out what is the benefit of the supercaliber and Epic WC bikes ? I like the design but not sure if I should change my Epic yet.
Epic wc at 1660g is the best xc bike given that it's stiff enough and has nice anti squat. Supercaliber rsl is 1950g iirc

zscs
Posts: 142
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2018 12:05 pm
Location: Hungary

by zscs

Didn't want to create a new topic; here is an interesting new frame from the German Bike Ahead Components: "The Frame". https://r2-bike.com/BIKE-AHEAD-COMPOSIT ... -UD-Carbon

Although BB is Pressfit, but quite a few positive things (to me at least):
- 30.9mm seat tube inner diameter
- brake hose lining is internal but NOT goes over the headset bearing :)
- 2 bottle cages (I know, that's the minimum nowadays)
- PM brake mount (I truly hate flat mount on my Lux CFR...)
- UDH
- I believe geometry is a good compromise between modern and classic (68.5°)
- lovely classic design
- 2k EUR for a 880g frame is... Maybe on the pricy side but at least made in Portugal.

Image

MagicShite
Posts: 455
Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2016 3:33 pm

by MagicShite

^The Voice Rhapsody VP Series is far superior and cheaper lol.

I'm half glad they remain mostly cdm.

zscs
Posts: 142
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2018 12:05 pm
Location: Hungary

by zscs

MagicShite wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2024 2:07 am
^The Voice Rhapsody VP Series is far superior and cheaper lol.

I'm half glad they remain mostly cdm.
Thanks for sharing this info, I've never heard of this frame. Cool and relatively cheap! https://voicevelo.com/products/voice%E7 ... tsId=10009
Image

Are there any alternatives nowadays?

Can be useful for others what I've found so far. I'm planning to build a WW hillclimb machine instead of my current one (which is based on an old 1250g Canyon GC CF frame) with a carbon rigid fork, of course. Officially Orbea Alma is the only one which supports rigid fork (Orbea Spirit) and - if I'm not mistaken - Scott Scales also support rigid fork ( see Scott RF 29": https://r2-bike.com/SCOTT-Rigid-Fork-29 ... 0-mm-Boost ). Of course, those framesets may cost 3-3.5k EUR...

Basic Bikes offers also a framet for ~1100 EUR, which looks like a re-branded frame from AliExpress (haven't found any info on this): https://www.basicbikes.de/carbon-mtb-rahmenset
Image

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robbosmans
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Joined: Sun Aug 26, 2018 12:40 pm
Location: Central Belgium
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by robbosmans

You can’t really compare open molds against the Bike Ahead frame. €2000 for a hardtail from a reputable brand is a really good deal

MagicShite
Posts: 455
Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2016 3:33 pm

by MagicShite

robbosmans wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2024 8:02 am
You can’t really compare open molds against the Bike Ahead frame. €2000 for a hardtail from a reputable brand is a really good deal
bruh Voice is not open molds.

I've been racing it two years ago. Won a race with it. EXCELLENT HT.

Only downside to the frame really is their version of "steering limit" headset doesn't really work well.
1709643595223 - Copy.jpg

aeroskii
Posts: 36
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2023 9:13 pm

by aeroskii

aeroskii wrote:
Sun Sep 24, 2023 4:10 pm
Snabb wrote:
Tue Aug 15, 2023 8:53 am
thepassista wrote:
Mon Aug 07, 2023 3:23 pm
a german webshop rushed the things a bit :D

Supercaliber gen2 9.7 SL https://www.die-edelhelfer.de/trek-supe ... ower-surge
Supercaliber gen2 9.8 SLR https://www.die-edelhelfer.de/trek-supe ... -red-smoke
The supercaliber frame weight isn´t that light compared to other frames that has 100-120 mm. So with a good lock-out what is the benefit of the supercaliber and Epic WC bikes ? I like the design but not sure if I should change my Epic yet.
Epic wc at 1660g is the best xc bike given that it's stiff enough and has nice anti squat. Supercaliber rsl is 1950g iirc
meant epic evo oop

by Weenie


Visit starbike.com Online Retailer for HighEnd cycling components
Great Prices ✓    Broad Selection ✓    Worldwide Delivery ✓

www.starbike.com



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