Did I double olive?

[abLEmiaB]

I have been building a bike for a while. I put it together with R8100 groupset. I don't remember in detail putting the brakes together but thought I'd done it right. In the meantime I stumbled across things like Rhino mentioning the secret double-olive problem on his story one time, and then I searched and found YouTube and internet links confirming. So now I'm worried I double-olived. My main reason is the nut doesn't sit as flush as I might expect. I torqued to 5Nm spec (checked again now) with a crowsfoot spanner. I don't want to disassemble and look inside. Does this look right? It's the same gap on each lever.

[wltz]

You should not have any gaps on the levers. I would disassemble to check: if everything looks right you can just re-insert and re-tighten, people have been reusing olives when re-cabling to new shifters without issues.

[abLEmiaB]

Everything feels good. I just don't remember if I put an olive on the end of the hose when Shimano leaves one inside the lever out of the box. So if n00bs put an olive on the hose and there's one already inside the lever body then you end up with two olives and the lever doesn't function properly.

I haven't ridden the bike yet, still building, but I bled successfully and the lever pull feels good in the workshop (aka bedroom). It's more the gap from the nut flange not cinching down against the lever body I'm wondering about.

[CampagYOLO]

Everything feels good. I just don't remember if I put an olive on the end of the hose when Shimano leaves one inside the lever out of the box. So if n00bs put an olive on the hose and there's one already inside the lever body then you end up with two olives and the lever doesn't function properly.

I haven't ridden the bike yet, still building, but I bled successfully and the lever pull feels good in the workshop (aka bedroom). It's more the gap from the nut flange not cinching down against the lever body I'm wondering about.

As mentioned above there shouldn't be a gap. I'd undo it and check it out, there's likely to be 2 olives there but 1 will still be reusable. If you're quick a rebleed is not needed.

[abLEmiaB]

Ok thanks both of you

[kode54]

I have been building a bike for a while. I put it together with R8100 groupset. I don't remember in detail putting the brakes together but thought I'd done it right. In the meantime I stumbled across things like Rhino mentioning the secret double-olive problem on his story one time, and then I searched and found YouTube and internet links confirming. So now I'm worried I double-olived. My main reason is the nut doesn't sit as flush as I might expect. I torqued to 5Nm spec (checked again now) with a crowsfoot spanner. I don't want to disassemble and look inside. Does this look right? It's the same gap on each lever.

Looks like you didn’t cinch the bolt tight enough. Two olives would result in a larger gap. Just for peace of mind, remove and visually check to make sure. Putting two olives in and tightening it down will destroy the shifter internals or bladder or something else. I would not mess around and take a look to be certain.

[abLEmiaB]

It's to 5Nm but the responses are enough that I'll disassemble and report back with the definitive answer.

[kode54]

It's to 5Nm but the responses are enough that I'll disassemble and report back with the definitive answer.

I bottom mine so there’s no gap. I never torqued it. I figure you can’t go wrong since the olives just crush under and around it.

[splzd]

But how can the nut be tightened to a specific torque (5Nm) and to a specific position (sit flush) at the same time? That would mean that the resistance that results in 5Nm torque is not caused by the compression of the olive, but by the collar of the bolt rubbing the lever body. Seems like a weird construction.

[DanielNorway]

I have allways hit 6Nm before the gap is closed. I have followed the manual and I have never had any issues.

The Shimano manual says 5-6Nm, and doesnt mention anything about the gap.

[K4m1k4z3]

It's to 5Nm but the responses are enough that I'll disassemble and report back with the definitive answer.

If it works and doesn't leak I wouldn't disassemble. You certainly have NOT double-olived.

It depends where the olive (relative to the hose end) stops inside the shifter body and starts crushing (expanding). There might be a millimeter or so in it. If it's further away from the hose end you will reach the recommended torque sooner. Excessive tightening trying to get the nut flange to sit flush would only result in a cracked shifter in this situation since the olive is already expanded against the shifter body walls and won't move further in, only expand.

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On a related note: The nuts (with the flanges) come with some sort of white cement-like substance pre-applied. However in Shimano tech docs they recommend greasing those threads (along with the olive) instead. Would you remove this white paste and re-grease the nut threads? Weird.

[Maddie]

On a related note: The nuts (with the flanges) come with some sort of white cement-like substance pre-applied. However in Shimano tech docs they recommend greasing those threads (along with the olive) instead. Would you remove this white paste and re-grease the nut threads? Weird.

That's what I wanted to add. Yes, remove that white stuff and just grease the threads very lightly.

[Fisherfreerider]

Did the threaded "nut" have any of that gray goop on the threads? If so, take it apart and remove all that crap.

[abLEmiaB]

It did

[MichaelB]

It's to 5Nm but the responses are enough that I'll disassemble and report back with the definitive answer.

If it works and doesn't leak I wouldn't disassemble. You certainly have NOT double-olived.

It depends where the olive (relative to the hose end) stops inside the shifter body and starts crushing (expanding). There might be a millimeter or so in it. If it's further away from the hose end you will reach the recommended torque sooner. Excessive tightening trying to get the nut flange to sit flush would only result in a cracked shifter in this situation since the olive is already expanded against the shifter body walls and won't move further in, only expand.

==============

On a related note: The nuts (with the flanges) come with some sort of white cement-like substance pre-applied. However in Shimano tech docs they recommend greasing those threads (along with the olive) instead. Would you remove this white paste and re-grease the nut threads? Weird.

+1 to ^^^

I stuffed a lever by overtightening to 'close the gap'. It cracked the shifter body.

I would be worried at all with that gap. If you double olived, I doubt that you'd get the thread to engage !