De Rosa Protos vs Pinarello Dogma F8

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Rogeliote
Posts: 110
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 9:12 pm
Location: Asturias (Spain)

by Rogeliote

Hi guys,

I am thinking to buy a new bike and I would like to share with you my preferences and doubts.

-The handlebar, stem and seatpost are going to be the 3t LTD range.
-The wheelset a Mavic Cosmic Ultimate.
-Saddle Fizik Arione or Antares R1 Custom
-Group Shimano Durace DI (the new campagnolo EPS v3 could be an option)
-Pedals Mavic or Time i-clic

But the problem is that I am doubting with the frame. I have two main options and a third one that could be interesting also:

- De Rosa Protos: I have a very good deal. I never had a true Italian frame and I believe that this is very exclusive. I have read that the weight is about 900 grams but I dont know if this weight is unpainted and without hardware. The negative point is that this frame is a little bit old, its original design comes from 2012.

- Pinarello Dogma F8 Rhino Edition. It is 1500 euros more expensive than the Protos but I have read very good things about it. The users of this forum usually say that it the best all rounder of the new frames. It is very nice but you can see a lot of them and is made in Asia. I belive its real weight is a bit more than the Protos but its aredinamic desing is very cool.

- Look 795 Aerolight: I have a good price from the model of 2015, 1.000 more than the protos and 500 less than the F8. As you know the package include seatpost, brakes, crankset, stem... so if you buy a complete bike it could be very good option. I believe that this is one of the best frames out there but there is something in its geometry that is strange for me. When I see it sometimes I fell in love and others I hate it! I am completely sure that its performance it is extraordinary.

So, this is my dilemma! All your advices and opinions are going to be very welcome!

Thank you for your help!

by Weenie


Visit starbike.com Online Retailer for HighEnd cycling components
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wheelsONfire
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by wheelsONfire

It's a dilemma for many to pick the one frameset that is "The frameset".
If you buy a standard paint F8 you save 500 euros.
Personally i think they look better than Rhino versions.

I would only have two of these framesets as an option, F8 and 795.
I think 795 will ride different than F8.
You may aswell put Time Skylon on this list instead of Protos.

No matter what the guys say, the only way to truely know is to test ride.
In the end it's still a chance you take so you have to figure what could be +/- for you.
Bikes:

Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)


Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.

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kgt
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Joined: Sun Jun 18, 2006 10:29 am
Location: Athens, Greece

by kgt

I would go for the Protos since the price is that good.
Don't expect it to weight 900gr but the ride will be great (according to the reviews), the frame is definitely more exclusive than F8 and a real made in Italy.
It looks much better than both F8 and 795 IMO as well.

http://www.cyclist.co.uk/de-rosa/159/de ... tos-review

Multebear
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Joined: Sat May 02, 2015 10:11 pm

by Multebear

I'm very much in love with the Dogma as well. I think it is beatifull, and it's a very well designed aeroframe. Not to many odd solutions, like aerobrakes or brake under BB. Those solutions always cause problems. Besides that Pinarello is just a really good name/brand, with a long history - and finally it's italian. One of my teammates has it, and he says it is really good, but not as stiff as the Dogma 65.1.

The look frame on the other hand really hurts my eyes. Another teammate bought it, and I didn't have the balls to tell him how horrible it looks. But then again, it's a question of taste. If he likes it, fine with me.

De Rosa is topquality. If the design is from 2012, then it's because it took 2 years to develop it. I was told, that De Rosa hired a topcarbon designer to improve their carbon frames, and he started with the protos. I don't remember his name or the company he came from. But it was one the big players.

I would choose between the Dogma and the Protos. And it's a hard choice. Both italian, both expensive, both good looking. Both aero - Dogma probably more aero, and Protos probably stiffer.

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wheelsONfire
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Location: NorthEU

by wheelsONfire

What is the great thing talking Protos? Very stiff harsh riding, no proven aero frame.

I would very much prefer ride quality and if aero matters, it should atleast be done using a wind tunnel.

Both Look and Time are well known for ride quality. Well, each to his own i guess!?
Bikes:

Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)


Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.

mike
Resident Pro
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Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2003 9:42 pm

by mike

i would go for the dogma f8. it would ride fabulously. if you buy the protos or the 795(which is ugly i think), you will be thinking about the dogma and why you should have bought it.

BlackMadone
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Joined: Wed Oct 15, 2014 6:12 pm

by BlackMadone

I have a Dogma F8 and I love it but I want a Protos and Divo too! So there you go

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zappafile123
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by zappafile123

My first piece of advice would be to disregard money as a consideration in your choice. As long as you can afford it, what difference is $1000 between drinks? In the end, you want to have NO REGRETS. My experience with compromising on money is it leads to regret more often than not.

Ive owned a few Italian bikes now and... each of them were better than their French counterparts (Look and Time). To generalise, the handling/geometries are just better. They are also more beautiful IMO. In general however, add at least 10% to their weight claims. My Basso Diamante and Bianchi Oltre XR2, claimed to be 830g (before paint) and 890g, were 1080 and 1040g respectively for the frame alone, ready to go.

There is a certain exclusivity to both the 795 and the Protos. On the other hand, Pinarello's are, in my mind, somewhat throw away. There has been a new dogma every 18 months and to me this just detracts from the brand image. Moreover, past Dogma's have a reputation for being overweight, extremely expensive Donkey's.

With those wheels, I would opt for the more compliant frame. Ultimates are crazy stiff and crazy stiff wheels with a crazy stiff frame is a bad combo.

Personally I would go for the Protos on looks alone. I would be a bit concerned however, because the latest King XS was an inferior frameset performance wise, relatively speaking.

heres another review of the protos

http://www.tour-magazin.de/technik/test ... 33979.html
FactorOne|SartoSeta|StorckF.3|Enigma EliteHSS|SworksSL6|ColnagoC60/V3Rs|DeRosa Protos|BianchiXR4/2|BMCSLR01 16|Cdale EvoHM|Focus IzMax|RidleyHe SL/SLX|BH Ulight|BassoDiamante|Scapin DyseysS8|TimeRXRS/ZXRS|TCR SL|RidleyNoah|Look585|CerveloS5/S3

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Rogeliote
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Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 9:12 pm
Location: Asturias (Spain)

by Rogeliote

Hi Guys,

Thanks a lot for your answers and comments. I have been reading very carefully all of them.

Definitely the Look 795 is out of my list. I am doubting between the Protos and F8 (the Skylon and C60 could be secondary options).

There is a very good point with the Protos, you can personalize the paint with no extra cost, wich is great but I am afraid about the real frame weight, there is no consistency about the information in the magazines on the net: from 800 grms to 1300 gms... As you can imagine something about 1100 gms is ok but 1300 gms I belive that is a lot.

I think that with F8 the weigh is about 1000 gms + 380 for the fork wich is more reasonable.

About the Protos and Mavic CCU combination I am sure this is not the most confortable one, I am going to have this advice in mind for exploring different alternativas (Perhaps Campagnolo EPS + Bora could be the answer).

In a few days I will take the decission and I will share it with you!

By the way If you have more coments I am going to keep my eyes open! :D :D :D

mimason
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Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 11:43 pm
Location: Florida

by mimason

Regarding F8. The handling is excellent; lively but not twitchy. It is actually comfortable as well despite is being stiff. It begs for long and low fit which lends itself into getting in to a good aero position and can be built relatively light. Choose matte paint to shave grams as the gloss would be heavier. Mine is a size 54 gloss red and with 32mm carbon clinchers and not trying to drop weigh is 6.9kg. I could easily get to 6.5 with tubs and a few other tricks or more choosing matte.

Can't comment on the Protos but I have 6k miles on the f8. Its a very nice bike. I think it would be fine with Ultimates as well. I ride 65s most of the time and can ride imperial centuries comfortably.

BlackMadone
Posts: 234
Joined: Wed Oct 15, 2014 6:12 pm

by BlackMadone

mimason wrote:Regarding F8. The handling is excellent; lively but not twitchy. It is actually comfortable as well despite is being stiff. It begs for long and low fit which lends itself into getting in to a good aero position and can be built relatively light. Choose matte paint to shave grams as the gloss would be heavier. Mine is a size 54 gloss red and with 32mm carbon clinchers and not trying to drop weigh is 6.9kg. I could easily get to 6.5 with tubs and a few other tricks or more choosing matte.

Can't comment on the Protos but I have 6k miles on the f8. Its a very nice bike. I think it would be fine with Ultimates as well. I ride 65s most of the time and can ride imperial centuries comfortably.

I wish I would have gone with matte colors...

BlackMadone
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Joined: Wed Oct 15, 2014 6:12 pm

by BlackMadone

I really want a Protos though... https://youtu.be/hojdxI4cuiI

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zappafile123
Posts: 655
Joined: Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:24 am

by zappafile123

BlackMadone wrote:I really want a Protos though... https://youtu.be/hojdxI4cuiI


yeah dam its such a fine looking machine.

Bora's are way better than Ultimates by virtue of the hubs alone. Definitely a better choice as an everyday wheel.
FactorOne|SartoSeta|StorckF.3|Enigma EliteHSS|SworksSL6|ColnagoC60/V3Rs|DeRosa Protos|BianchiXR4/2|BMCSLR01 16|Cdale EvoHM|Focus IzMax|RidleyHe SL/SLX|BH Ulight|BassoDiamante|Scapin DyseysS8|TimeRXRS/ZXRS|TCR SL|RidleyNoah|Look585|CerveloS5/S3

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jimaizumi
Posts: 717
Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2006 1:48 am

by jimaizumi

Its so trivial, isn't it? Our decision to buy certain bikes are based on anothers opinions but at the end of it all, its all about what is most appealing to the eye. I think both the Dogma and Protos are fine choices to be had. Just like you, I've never ridden both, do not have any close friends that have ridden both nor have extensive experience along a wide range of brands...

Just go with your hunch... in either case, you can't go wrong... the weight penalty shouldn't be much of an issue anyway.
THE PAST: 2005 C'dale R700, 2006 Spesh S-Works Tarmac Gerolsteiner, 2009 Pinarello Dogma FPX My Way, 2011 Time RXR VIP

THE PRESENT: 2016 Colnago C60 ST01, 2017 Wilier Cento 10 Ramato, Cinelli Gazetta

THE FUTURE: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

by Weenie


Visit starbike.com Online Retailer for HighEnd cycling components
Great Prices ✓    Broad Selection ✓    Worldwide Delivery ✓

www.starbike.com



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wheelsONfire
Posts: 6283
Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2014 8:15 am
Location: NorthEU

by wheelsONfire

Why not pick the bike that has best ride feel? Looks will fade out once you've seen it a few weeks, it's just a bike.

I would never trade ride feel for looks, i don't get why anyone should!?
Bikes:

Ax Lightness Vial EVO Race (2019.01.03)
Open *UP* (2016.04.14)
Paduano Racing Fidia (kind of shelved)


Ex bike; Vial EVO D, Vial EVO Ultra, Scott Foil, Paduano ti bike.

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